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Re:How 'DevOps' Is Killing the Developer (2014) by scarface74 on Thursday June 28, 2018 @10:51AM (#17417288)
The term "Full Stack Developer" is especially problematic because taken at it's literal meaning it suggests that a developer should be fully competent at ALL aspects of developing an application, which necessarily include deep understanding of system administration, database administration, tertiary dependency (caching apps like Redis, for example) administration, network infrastructure configuration and maintenance -- all of which are impossible for one person

Why is that impossible especially in the age of cloud? Infrastructure setup and configuration is just another API.

My knowledge of the full stack may not be wide, but it’s fairly deep. If you tell me I have to design and implement a full web application from scratch with no preexisting infrastructure, I can choose a pretty good set of technologies and best practices to get it done as a cloud hosted implementation all the way from net ops, dev ops (CI/CD), backend RDMS or NoSQL storage, a modern server side language, a web server, and a website.

The only part that would be wanting is the website implementation would be a simplistic Bootstrap UI without any modern front end frameworks. The best I could do right now would be either ASP.Net MVC or Jquery + handlebars. But not knowing a front end framework well enough is just because of lack of time to learn and that’s not what I’m concentrating on now.

As the size of the project grew, I would need to bring in specialists for the web (that’s not my forte) and devops (it would be a waste of my time to manage devops/netops) at scale.

Re:How 'DevOps' Is Killing the Developer (2014) by falcolas on Thursday June 28, 2018 @11:18AM (#17417569)
You could consider it to be another API - like that provided by AWS. An API with hundreds to thousands of endpoints, and each endpoint can have several dozen endpoint-specific arguments. An API that evolves over time, that you need to keep on top of.

And an API which, like all forms of abstraction, falls apart at the seams. There are still networks, interfaces, operating systems, files, cron jobs, sockets, flow logs, ACLs, security holes, and so forth.

Do you, as a developer, want to spend all the time required to keep up with that API? To be the one expected to fill the gaps when the abstraction falls apart? Or do you want to hire someone to take care of that for you?

Re:How 'DevOps' Is Killing the Developer (2014) by scarface74 on Thursday June 28, 2018 @11:31AM (#17417702)
You don’t just consider it an API, it is an API. No matter how you are using AWS - via the console, cloud formation templates, the cli, the various SDKs, etc. It all boils down to an API call.

I don’t want to have to be the only one, but I like having both the knowledge and the access not to have to wait on someone else. I gave up a job as an architect with so much red tape I couldn’t get anything done at a large company to be a senior developer at a small company where from day one I was given admin access to AWS (yes I have the skill set and the certifications for what they are worth).

Re:How 'DevOps' Is Killing the Developer (2014) by falcolas on Thursday June 28, 2018 @04:11PM (#17420075)
To me it's not about gatekeeping, it's about specialization. If you have a thousand lines of Javascript to write, troubleshoot, optimize, and deploy, you don't call the Ruby guy if you have a Javascript gal.

The same way you don't write, maintain, and extend a thousand lines of IAM policies and roles, network ACLs, and launch configs in CloudFormation templates when you can have a specialist do it for you.

That said, I can understand the desire to gatekeep as someone in an operations role. Our role (as a generalization) is about scalibility, reliability, and availability. Developers (as a generalization) tend to care more about velocity, blue sky projects, and minimizing effort for the outcome.

Maintaining a balance between those two mindsets requires a lot of skill.

Re:How 'DevOps' Is Killing the Developer (2014) by scarface74 on Thursday June 28, 2018 @04:44PM (#17420332)
I can see that. But when the developer needs to add a few more resources and configurations to AWS wouldn’t you rather have them already figure it out on a Dev account and give you a CF template to review than to hand you a list of resources they need?

The same with devops. I know the devops folks enjoy having sql upgrade scripts and build and deployment scripts (currently yml or CF templates) handed to them that have already been tested in a Dev environment.

Also, if the developer isn’t knowledgeable about scaleability for instance, no matter how many servers you add behind a load balancer, if they store session state in memory instead of using something like ElastiCache, there is nothing you can do operationally (well technically you can have sticky sessions but that’s gross).

Even if the developer doesn’t do every part of the stack, they still have to know how to.