I have to say that having GFA Basic on the Atari ST as my first real development language made a huge difference, given that it had code blocks, functions, local variables, typed variables, arrays and record types and built-in commands for OS calls, memory access, matrix operations and a ton of other stuff. Made moving to Turbo Pascal relatively easy.
http://www.geocities.ws/slaszcz/mup/prgnames.html
https://github.com/ggnkua/Atari_ST_Sources/blob/master/GFA%2...
Re:Massacring C Pointers
by LambdaComplex on Tuesday June 26, 2018 @10:43AM
(#17400933)
> I've interviewed a number of people who think that Java === computing. Not even the "JVM", mind you, but Java, the language, itself.
Could you elaborate on this? What exactly made you realize that was how/what they thought?
I had to ponder on what it is that really sets this sort of person apart, and I think it's the sort of sneering disdain at the idea that any of the other languages in the world are worth anything, or have any good ideas. Or maybe it's the way that when you ask them what's good or bad about some other language, you get back just a list of differences those languages have with Java, and it is simply assumed that all differences are ways in which they are inferior to Java.
And let me say again that it's not specifically Java. I've seen a couple of people that way with C, for instance, though not in an interview situation.
For people of certain of a certain psychological orientation, there is the additional challenge that having put away your first language, you now think you are a "Programmer (TM)", and learning that second language and learning that you have a number of misconceptions can strike at your very identity. People can get psychologically attached to their misconceptions if it means retaining the illusion that they have mastery.
Nowadays the easiest way to screw this up is to go to a computer science/engineering program that uses just one language. As tempting as it may be from a curriculum simplicity perspective, it's a big mistake. I've interviewed a number of people who think that Java === computing. Not even the "JVM", mind you, but Java, the language, itself. I don't blame Java for this, it's the education. Java itself is not a great lens to understand computer capabilities through, and it's a miserable language to be your lens to understand the general capabilities of programming through, especially 10 years ago. (It's slowly getting better, with easy closures and such, but it's still stuff bolted on the side 20 year later.)
Looking at it from that perspective you can see why 8-bit-era BASIC was even worse than that. It offers a very impoverished view of the computer's capabilities and a very impoverished view of the possibilities of computing. (It was possible to rehabilitate BASIC into at least a passable language; I'm glad I don't have to use Visual Basic to do my job, but it's still light years ahead of the BASICs that still used line numbers, and I've done Real Work (TM) in it, albeit a long time ago.) A 21st-century Java-only programmer is substantially better equipped than a 20th-century 8-bit-era BASIC-only programmer.
(By "8-bit-era", I mean the timeframe, not necessarily the CPU. I'm fairly sure there were BASIC implementations with line numbers and such on non-8-bit-machines, and they'd still be dangerous. But as computers got into the 16- and especially the 32-bit era, even BASIC had to grow up.)