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Re:Making Debian Responsible For Its Actions by prodigal_erik on Tuesday September 28, 2010 @06:41AM (#1735219)
This. The point of Gems and Maven and the CPAN client and all this other crap is to smuggle code into a production box while carelessly failing to get it into the platform's database of what's installed where and what depends on it. They replace one tool that knows everything that's going on, with many tools each of which can't.

Somehow we got stuck with a critical mass of small-scale developers who never faced the nightmare of somehow keeping the right tarballs on hundreds of machines in different roles without good tools, so now we all get to relive it.

Re:Making Debian Responsible For Its Actions by cemerick on Tuesday September 28, 2010 @07:56AM (#1735371)
That's hilarious. Users of Maven and CPAN represent a "critical mass of small-scale developers"? Holy shit.

A similar idea was voiced a few days ago, specifically regarding Java libraries (http://fnords.wordpress.com/2010/09/24/the-real-problem-with...).

My response remains the same: Debian (or what-have-you) is but one distro among many, and those of us that treat such things as important but fundamentally commodity deployment platforms have no wish to spend our lives babysitting whatever package manager happens to be on the operating system we're using that month/year/whatever. Further, plenty of people have plenty of good reasons for deploying on Windows and OS X, so using tools that work well there make sense.

The priorities of the various linux distros aren't everyone else's priorities – which somehow seems to come as a galloping shock to some.

Re:Making Debian Responsible For Its Actions by billswift on Tuesday September 28, 2010 @04:19PM (#1737116)
That is why I use Slackware. Installing new software by hand from tarballs is a bit tedious compared to package managers, but it is transparent, and when I am done I can be pretty sure it is going to work. I have tried other distros, even Debian once (for some reason the Debian wouldn't let me sign in as root, I never did figure out why), but I keep coming back to Slackware - for its transparency.
Re:Making Debian Responsible For Its Actions by koenigdavidmj on Wednesday October 20, 2010 @11:26AM (#1811563)
And Slackware's packaging is light enough that it is fairly simple to write wrappers around gems/CPAN modules/Python eggs. The latter two have prewritten SlackBuilds that you can use, assuming that the setup.py is not doing anything too shady.
Re:Making Debian Responsible For Its Actions by phaylon on Tuesday September 28, 2010 @11:18AM (#1735922)
With CPAN (and local-lib and/or perlbrew) I can have per-user libraries, per-application libraries, and it doesn't interfere at all with the dependencies of the system. If a library that both my application and the system use, and they fix a bug that includes an incompatibility, I can upgrade my applications without fiddling with the system, I don't need to take care to break APT in the process (fun times). I'm not even talking about possibilities like copying someone else's local-lib to my own environment to help them debugging, while still having my own setup stay untouched.

So, I guess I disagree. These tools provide a lot more than the usual package management.

To me it seems backwards to try to manage libraries globally when their use-cases are often already localized.