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Re:Apple to Close iPhone Security Hole That Police Use to Cr... by bb88 on Wednesday June 13, 2018 @10:08PM (#17308695)
> Most crimes, and especially the violent crimes that scare people the most, require physical actions that leave physical traces.

To borrow a page from your argument book, if physical evidence alone were enough, we wouldn't have so many unsolved homicides. Look at the KC unsolved murder list for 2017:

http://kcmo.gov/police/homicide-3/2017-unsolved-homicides/#....

> You can't smuggle guns via SMS.

Technically, you can send the plans for a plastic gun over the internet now, which just needs to be printed on the other side.

You can also send a virus, if the other side has a gene sequencer.

> You can't vandalize shop windows over the Internet.

You can vandalize digital signage over the internet. As well a steal credit cards from the store's credit card readers.

> You can't kill people with a digital photograph.

Well... technically it's animated gif. But yeah you can.

http://fortune.com/2017/03/22/twitter-epilepsy-gif/

> Maybe LEOs believe their own rhetoric or maybe they just realize that "think of the victims of inside trading!" isn't the sort of terrifying scenario that will get the public on their side.

Honestly, I think law enforcement believes that they need more tools. I don't think they want unsolved murders any more than the citizens do. So telling law enforcement officers, "you can pry open my iPhone from my cold dead hands" tends to ring hollow, especially if they really are of the honest kind and really do want to put criminals away as well as respecting your privacy.

Re:Apple to Close iPhone Security Hole That Police Use to Cr... by krapp on Thursday June 14, 2018 @08:40AM (#17311166)
>Honestly, I think law enforcement believes that they need more tools. I don't think they want unsolved murders any more than the citizens do.

The US Constitution makes it clear that the rights of the people to be secure in their persons and possessions is paramount, but for a narrowly defined list of exceptions. That crimes may go unsolved because the state is kept on too short a leash, or because modern technology has made their job more difficult, is a feature, not a bug. A government with perfect knowledge about its citizens behavior and correspondence, or one that can perfectly enforce its laws, is indistinguishable from tyranny.

>So telling law enforcement officers, "you can pry open my iPhone from my cold dead hands" tends to ring hollow, especially if they really are of the honest kind and really do want to put criminals away as well as respecting your privacy.

They can pry my iPhone from my cold dead hands, or my live warm hands will hand it over if they have a warrant, but it will remain encrypted either way, for no other reason than I have the right to do so, and they have no right to demand otherwise.

Re:Apple to Close iPhone Security Hole That Police Use to Cr... by philipkglass on Wednesday June 13, 2018 @10:44PM (#17308860)
Is the murder clearance rate worse than it was in the late 20th century? Also worse than before iOS implemented full disk encryption? Your hyperbolic original claim was that search warrants will be useless in a paperless society. Had you made a mild and reasonable claim like "the contents of a phone, if available in unencrypted form, can help to solve crimes" I wouldn't have bothered to reply.

As for the rest, I can't tell if you are just trying to demonstrate that you can think creatively, or if you actually think that iOS disk encryption is an important element of a scheme to get away with murdering someone with a pathogenic virus recreated from sequence data. (Or to get away with 3D printing guns under illegal circumstances, or deliberately inducing an epileptic fit.)

Re:Apple to Close iPhone Security Hole That Police Use to Cr... by bb88 on Thursday June 14, 2018 @01:59AM (#17309631)
> Is the murder clearance rate worse than it was in the late 20th century?

Why do you insist on this artificial restriction on whether or not police officers should have access to the data on an iPhone? It seems to me this would help the clearance rate if anything. It's another tool in the arsenal.

> As for the rest, I can't tell if you are just trying to demonstrate that you can think creatively...

The internet allows new styles of crimes, perhaps crimes you or I have never really thought about yet. Or maybe I've been paying attention to crimes on the internet lately. And for the record, I'm not the first to think about resequencing viruses. See point #5 here:

https://www.vox.com/2014/5/22/5739380/why-were-never-really-...

And to answer the rest of your comment, your rhetoric reads stronger than it truly is.

Re:Apple to Close iPhone Security Hole That Police Use to Cr... by philipkglass on Thursday June 14, 2018 @02:55AM (#17309868)
It's a high bar to show that encrypted devices enable a new era of unsolvable crimes. Isn't that what you were originally warning about, with the line about search warrants being useless in a paperless society? Such bold claims call for at least a bit of empirical evidence, like statistically significant solve rate declines vs. the immediate pre-mobile era.