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Re:A ranking of the highest tech salaries in the US, adjuste... by joshuamorton on Tuesday February 13, 2018 @07:06PM (#16372148)
Naively adjusting CoL like this always over-corrects and favors lower cost places. This would only be a valid comparison if you saved exactly $0 each year. If you are able to save a portion of your income (as hopefully anyone with any of these salaries is), linear comparisons don't make sense.

You need to compare the difference in CoL as the percentage of that salary that goes towards CoL. In other words, if you save 50%, to keep the same standard, you need to CoL adjust only the other 50% (and maybe a bit more to keep your emergency fund weighted).

grumble

Re:A ranking of the highest tech salaries in the US, adjuste... by sotojuan on Tuesday February 13, 2018 @07:19PM (#16372243)
> You need to compare the difference in CoL as the percentage of that salary that goes towards CoL.

Great insight. Here in NYC, I know a few frugal programmers who share a 2 bedroom with a friend such that he pays about 25% of his income in rent (that's A LOT of money to save/enjoy life with). Another is nearing 40% but because he prefers living alone. And there's always the "I want to live like they did in Friends/I want a 10 min commute" coworker that spends 60%+ on rent.

These kind of studies make it seem like most people live like the latter, when my personal experience as an engineer in NYC, the city is not unaffordable at all ... unless you want to own property ASAP. Honestly, what I've learned is that COL discussions are hard because people spend money differently and value different things.

Re:A ranking of the highest tech salaries in the US, adjuste... by TheCoelacanth on Tuesday February 13, 2018 @11:37PM (#16373525)
It pretty much all comes down to the basket of goods that you assume that will be purchased.

If your basket of goods includes a few acres of land these estimates will dramatically underestimate how much more expensive NYC is than low COL areas.

If your basket of goods includes a lot of world-class arts and dining NYC would probably end up being less expensive than a lot of low COL areas because you would have to do a lot of traveling out of the low COL area for that.

People have widely differing preferences of life-style so it is very difficult to come up with a single number to describe COL differences that applies to very many people.

Re:A ranking of the highest tech salaries in the US, adjuste... by banku_brougham on Wednesday February 14, 2018 @01:41AM (#16373969)
I’m not so sure. In Austin, with the average salary you could buy a house. In New York, no way.
Re:A ranking of the highest tech salaries in the US, adjuste... by havetocharge on Wednesday February 14, 2018 @08:19AM (#16375500)
You might be missing the original point, which highlights that not everyone might want to buy "a house" in the first place.
Re:A ranking of the highest tech salaries in the US, adjuste... by banku_brougham on Wednesday February 14, 2018 @10:34AM (#16376473)
Yes I think i understand now. But doesnt this line of reasoning lead to an absurdity? As in “this article is poor because if neglects the edge case if someone living in his van and saving 80% of his NYC salary.”
Re:A ranking of the highest tech salaries in the US, adjuste... by TheCoelacanth on Wednesday February 14, 2018 @11:09AM (#16376811)
Someone living in a studio apartment or a one bedroom apartment is not a edge case; it is a very common lifestyle choice.
Re:A ranking of the highest tech salaries in the US, adjuste... by closeparen on Wednesday February 14, 2018 @12:14PM (#16377349)
The price of a small apartment in an expensive city is still high enough to create a massive chasm: in a cheap city, you could easily pay less than $1k/mo for one, or live with roommates and a log commute for closer to $500.

Not to mention that the rent in expensive cities only rises. It’s even more important to become an owner if you want to stay more than a little while.

Re:A ranking of the highest tech salaries in the US, adjuste... by TheCoelacanth on Wednesday February 14, 2018 @04:04PM (#16379343)
> in a cheap city, you could easily pay less than $1k/mo for one, or live with roommates and a log commute for closer to $500.

Yes, but you aren't spending your entire income on housing. What type of housing you choose has a huge effect on the relative cost-of-living between two locations.

Let's take two hypothetical locations, L1 and L2. In L2, housing is three times as expensive, goods in the category G1 are 50% more expensive because you have to buy them locally and retailers have higher expenses and goods in the category G2 are the same price because you order them from Amazon. You make $100k in L1, how much do you need to make to have the same lifestyle in L2?

Scenario 1: In L1, you spend $20k on housing, $20k on G1 and $60k on G2. To have the same lifestyle in L2, you need to spend $60k on housing, $30k on G1 and $60k on G2 for a total of $150k. So for you, L2 has a COL of 150% of L1.

Scenario 2: In L1, you spend $60k on housing, $30k on G1 and $10k on G2. To have the same lifestyle in L2, you need to spend $180k on housing, $45k on G1 and $10k on G2 for a total of $235k. So for you, L2 has a COL of 235% of L1.

So, which one is the real COL? They are both are equally valid. COL only makes sense in the context of a specific lifestyle. The best these single number answers can do is to guess what the average person's spending patterns will be, but people naturally self-select towards areas that are more favorable to their preferred lifestyle which means that the average spending patterns are often not an accurate reflection of the preferences of people who have chosen to live in that area.

Re:A ranking of the highest tech salaries in the US, adjuste... by mirashii on Tuesday February 13, 2018 @07:44PM (#16372392)
Totally agreed, and I personally remind people of the savings aspect quite often. If you target saving a percentage of your salary, like many people do, 20% in the NYC is a lot more savings than 20% in Montreal.

This particular article is even more egregious though. Having the "adjusted tech salary" in Austin be $200k is a little bit absurd. I don't understand how they possibly got these numbers, but the process seems even more flawed than just neglecting to talk about savings.

Re:A ranking of the highest tech salaries in the US, adjuste... by armenarmen on Tuesday February 13, 2018 @08:13PM (#16372547)
I'm guessing that a part of the $200k's justification is that Texas has no state income tax, which results in an immediate 12(?)% raise when moving from CA
Re:A ranking of the highest tech salaries in the US, adjuste... by dragonwriter on Wednesday February 14, 2018 @01:52AM (#16374005)
> I'm guessing that a part of the $200k's justification is that Texas has no state income tax, which results in an immediate 12(?)% raise when moving from CA

$200K in CA, for a single filer, has a marginal income tax rate of 9.3%; the total rate is 8.01%

Re:A ranking of the highest tech salaries in the US, adjuste... by optimusclimb on Wednesday February 14, 2018 @01:41AM (#16373970)
Effective tax rate at these salary ranges for CA is closer to 7-8%.
Re:A ranking of the highest tech salaries in the US, adjuste... by closeparen on Tuesday February 13, 2018 @08:54PM (#16372783)
Two major use cases for savings are paying the rent if you’re laid off, and making a down payment on a house. Both of which depend on local CoL.
Re:A ranking of the highest tech salaries in the US, adjuste... by andrewmutz on Tuesday February 13, 2018 @08:32PM (#16372653)
Or does it just assume that your savings eventually get spent in the city in question?

You would be able to save a nominally higher amount in a high cost-of-living area, but if those funds ultimately would be spent in that place, then is it an important distinction?

Re:A ranking of the highest tech salaries in the US, adjuste... by JamesBarney on Tuesday February 13, 2018 @10:16PM (#16373141)
This is only true if you are going to spend your savings in a place with a cost of living. I'm not sure what % of people move cities when they retire but leaving behind an entire life after you've sunk grown roots has it's costs.
Re:A ranking of the highest tech salaries in the US, adjuste... by acchow on Tuesday February 13, 2018 @08:12PM (#16372544)
Also over-corrects for people who spend a significant amount outside of the country/city they live.
Re:A ranking of the highest tech salaries in the US, adjuste... by jdtang13 on Tuesday February 13, 2018 @07:38PM (#16372357)
> This would only be a valid comparison if you saved exactly $0 each year.

Sounds like me. Just kidding, this is a really valid point, and I never thought about this missing variable.

Re:A ranking of the highest tech salaries in the US, adjuste... by sjwright on Tuesday February 13, 2018 @09:09PM (#16372855)
Except it matters what you eventually do with those savings. If you end up spending that money in the same city. Therefore the GP really should have said:

This would only be a valid comparison if you don't plan to repatriate a substantial portion of your earnings to a low CoL city.

Re:A ranking of the highest tech salaries in the US, adjuste... by arikrak on Tuesday February 13, 2018 @08:28PM (#16372633)
Also there are many things people spend on that don't cost more in one place than another, e.g ordering from Amazon. Or going on vacation to another area.
Re:A ranking of the highest tech salaries in the US, adjuste... by arebop on Tuesday February 13, 2018 @08:04PM (#16372493)
Isn't $0/year savings a pretty realistic estimate for Americans? It agrees with the stats I've seen, which admittedly aren't focused on the tech industry or the top 5% income quantile.
Re:A ranking of the highest tech salaries in the US, adjuste... by xyzzyz on Tuesday February 13, 2018 @08:11PM (#16372538)
This article is talking explicitly about tech jobs, and for tech workers, $0/year savings is not realistic unless they are in particularly dire situation (for example, below average job, lots of debt, and medical problems in family at the same time).