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Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by x0x0 on Friday February 02, 2018 @02:11PM (#16293332)
They're not actually well compensated.

http://www.businessinsider.com/charts-expose-how-badly-nfl-p...

They're not actually protected in any way, because NFL contracts aren't guaranteed. Imagine what you would do if your doctor worked for your boss, and when your doctor asked if you were injured, telling the truth would allow your boss to fire you on the spot with zero compensation. Every time the subject comes up there's lots of whining by the NFL, but somehow the NBA, NHL, and MLB survived with essentially guaranteed contracts.

NFL players also don't actually have options. Scholarships are a joke and most of them learn virtually nothing. They started down the path to the NFL well before they were adults capable of making decisions, and by the time they're eligible for an NFL career, they typically don't have the academics to do much else. (Obviously there are exceptions, but Richard Sherman is not your average NFL player.)

Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by softawre on Friday February 02, 2018 @02:33PM (#16293500)
Are you making the argument that a $million+/year is not "well compensated"? You can play for 2-3 years and never work again if you're smart with your money.
Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by DoreenMichele on Friday February 02, 2018 @03:15PM (#16293842)
if you're smart with your money.

Achieving this goal usually requires you to avoid serious brain damage. Repeated concussions and wisely living off the wealth you acquired in a few short years while still very young by managing it extraordinarily well for decades to come are probably mutually exclusive.

Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by grasshopperpurp on Friday February 02, 2018 @03:54PM (#16294137)
Don't forget the medical bills after football, which your former team(s) will not cover. I haven't verified the stat, but one of the 30-for-30 shorts said that something like 75% of NFL players are broke within 5 years of retirement.
Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by jedberg on Friday February 02, 2018 @04:09PM (#16294209)
The pool at my aunt and uncle's house has a huge Raiders mural in it, because they guy who owned it before them was a player for the Raiders until he went broke and they got it in a foreclosure sale.
Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by zaphirplane on Friday February 02, 2018 @09:01PM (#16295714)
Many former actors, lotto winners are also broke afterwards. Maybe a lot of millionaires go broke after the cash dries up and they continue their millionaire life style. The relation to medical bills seems unproven
Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by DoreenMichele on Friday February 02, 2018 @09:20PM (#16295767)
Yes. In fact, two thirds of lottery winners are bankrupt within 5 years.

Still, medical coverage in the US generally sucks and I would hate to be saddled with medical bills following being a career athlete and no longer having the big NFL salary. I can't imagine it's happy fun times.

Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by aje403 on Friday February 02, 2018 @04:21PM (#16294279)
Brain damage has very little do with why these guys go broke
Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by DoreenMichele on Friday February 02, 2018 @04:34PM (#16294385)
Probably true. But I wasn't positing an explanation for why they go broke. I was only suggesting that brain damage is a de facto barrier to successfully making that money last a lifetime, which most of them fail to do. The argument that, hypothetically, this is enough money to live on for life is rather specious since few of them actually do so. Being an NFL player for a few short years is not a well known path to permanent financial security and ability to cavalierly choose to not bother to work ever again.
Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by smsm42 on Friday February 02, 2018 @04:58PM (#16294535)
> The argument that, hypothetically, this is enough money to live on for life is rather specious since few of them actually do so.

But this is not because they don't get enough money and more money would fix it (well, it it could be $trillions then maybe but it is never going to be that). It's because they don't have the right tools (widely understood) to manage their money properly, and their income structure is unlike income structure of many regular people (huge sums for very short period, then nothing - as opposed to much smaller sums over much longer period) and it requires very unobvious actions to make it work. If you have literally millions of dollars in your account, it's very hard not to buy some nice expensive things - even if you know you'd need those millions for decades to come, your brain doesn't really work this way. Some people manage it properly and create brands and side businesses for themselves or just live with reasonable expenses and are ok. Some spend too much and end up broke.

Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by DoreenMichele on Friday February 02, 2018 @04:59PM (#16294547)
I never suggested more money would fix it. Just that multiple concussions are likely a serious handicap for being able to accomplish something most people can't pull off to begin with.
Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by smsm42 on Friday February 02, 2018 @04:50PM (#16294484)
I don't think the damage there is as immediate as NFL players being basically legally incompetent and unable to take conscious decisions. It's probably more likely that they have no experience of managing a budget, saving for long term and planning their future - a trait shared by many people who never ever put a foot on a football field. And when you get $ton-of-money and have no experience in managing your finances, pretty soon you're broke. Look up the statistics of the gold rushes - a lot of people coming into sudden wealth got broke pretty soon, and didn't need any hitting on the head for that to happen. The percentage of people that got wealthy and were able to keep it long term is depressingly low.
Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by fpig on Friday February 02, 2018 @11:49PM (#16296251)
Every person I know who got wealthy is still wealthy except one (stocks). None of them blew any significant part of their money on consumption. I assume this holds in general, too, if you count all people who get rich, not just lottery winners, athletes, etc.

This "no experience managing a budget" stuff is hilarious, you don't need special knowledge not to blow millions. It is not hard. Let's call it what it is for most people - being trash, living extravagantly, and not thinking about the future. It's far more about character than about financial knowledge.

Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by smsm42 on Saturday February 03, 2018 @11:31PM (#16301352)
Statistics proves it is harder than you think.
Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by fpig on Sunday February 04, 2018 @06:31AM (#16302363)
That's a worthless post without sources. I don't believe statistics would prove that, I am guessing they would prove the opposite, that most wealthy people don't blow their money.
Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by rayiner on Friday February 02, 2018 @02:52PM (#16293684)
Most players make closer to the league minimum ($500k) for just 2-3 years. After taxes that’s about $500-750k. Even if you’re smart about your money, you’re saving maybe $350-500k. That’s not “never work again” money.
Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by Consultant32452 on Friday February 02, 2018 @03:22PM (#16293890)
$500k/yr for 3 years is "never work again" money for me. That's $1.5 Million. If you pull out what many financial advisors recommend, 4%, that's $60k/yr for the rest of your life. That's above the US median household income.
Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by kurthr on Friday February 02, 2018 @04:18PM (#16294259)
If you don't pay taxes on that $1.5M, your living expenses (in jail) could also be quite low... but you won't magically end up with all the money. With half the money gone to taxes living on $30k/yr (non-inflation adjusted) doesn't sound so fun.
Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by Consultant32452 on Friday February 02, 2018 @04:27PM (#16294328)
That's true, I hadn't considered taxes. I'd be very surprised to find out that NFL players are getting a W-2. Most likely they're all incorporated so they can claim all sorts of stuff as business expenses which would get their tax rate way below 50%. But you're right, it's probably more like $45-50k instead of $60k.

Still though, the median household income is in the $50ks. The 4% withdrawal rate means the base amount still grows with inflation, and so does your yearly withdrawal.

In other words, you can live a middle class life without ever working again. I would probably prefer to live a better lifestyle if that were an option. Sure, $1+ million isn't "fuck you" money, but it is "don't have to work ever again" money.

Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by rayiner on Friday February 02, 2018 @04:35PM (#16294391)
Players are employees of the teams they play for. It’s very hard even for high income employees to reduce their tax liability. Even Tim Cook pays about 50% taxes on his bonuses.

The median household income thing is also misleading. People earn much more with age. $30k is a good income for a 25-year old. It's in the bottom third for people above age 35. (It's even worse if you consider only college graduates, which NFL players almost all are.)

Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by criddell on Saturday February 03, 2018 @01:26PM (#16298777)
> Players are employees of the teams they play for.

Are you sure about that? I was under the impression that they were all contractors.

Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by Consultant32452 on Friday February 02, 2018 @04:51PM (#16294493)
It's a little harder perhaps for Tim Cook to finagle his state of residency compared to a person that travels for a living. Most of these people are not paying NYC income tax. In fact, I'd be surprised if they couldn't establish residency in states without an income tax at all. This 'pro sports tax advice' site specifically and vaguely hints at controlling your state of residency. http://www.prosportstax.com/Images/Attachments/rn4b61f78e0a8...

Also worth noting the NFL has a 2:1 match up to $10k/yr. So every year you put $10k into your NFL 401k the NFL gives you $20k in tax free income.

A quick google search didn't give me a good indication of what the royalties are to low end pro athletes. I would not be surprised if the after tax on those is greater than the taxes on their traditional income.

Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by harryh on Saturday February 03, 2018 @09:13AM (#16297680)
It's worth noting that when athletes travel for games they have to pay state (and sometimes city) taxes for the cities they travel to which means their state of residency matters less than you might think.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jock_tax

Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by macintux on Friday February 02, 2018 @04:04PM (#16294185)
$60k/year won't get you very far in 20 years, and even today won't get you far at all if you have to pay medical expenses on the damage you received playing the game.
Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by Consultant32452 on Friday February 02, 2018 @04:19PM (#16294270)
The 4% rate is chosen specifically because it's low enough for your retirement savings to continue to grow with inflation.

I don't really see your point about $60k not getting you far at all since it's more than half the country makes. I understand you might have a more privileged view of what kind of lifestyle you expect to live, but you'd be doing better than half the country. You'll be fine.

Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by macintux on Friday February 02, 2018 @05:04PM (#16294567)
You're a NFL player. By definition you're among the, what, best 1% of players in college. You, of course, go in planning to have a short career, because you're young and invincible and the best.

So of course after 3 years of living like a monk you have $1.5 million stashed away...contrary to all rational expectations.

Well, less, because after income taxes and because as a young, invincible man among the best to play sports you spend money, maybe you have $300k left. If you're lucky.

But you're now unemployed, so you need healthcare. And the mortgage on your house is at least half that $60k/year because you're a young invincible sports hero.

You've been earning a half million dollars up to this point, so it's a safe bet it'll be very hard to scale your expenses down to $60k/year.

Anyway, I don't know where I'm going with this, except that your expectations of what an NFL player can/will do after being physically tortured for several years (high school, college, NFL) with hidden mental damage and having been a young, invincible man told you're the best of the best and surrounded by people eager to piggyback on your success...may be optimistic.

Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by Consultant32452 on Friday February 02, 2018 @05:17PM (#16294642)
Yeah, I certainly won't argue that there are huge cultural problems that will impede any person's ability to make sound personal finance decisions. And those cultural problems are magnified for someone like an NFL player. But I still think it's important to have rational discussions where were acknowledge that we could choose to live a different way. We could choose to think about money differently.
Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by roguecoder on Friday February 02, 2018 @03:23PM (#16293903)
The average lifetime earnings of a programmer are higher than professional athletes: http://www.businessinsider.com/better-to-be-a-software-engin... And my job doesn't expect me to sacrifice my mental and physical health, setting me up for a shortened lifetime of degenerative neurological disease in exchange for that cash.
Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by JamesBarney on Friday February 02, 2018 @03:43PM (#16294045)
They didn't discount future earnings. i.e. You wouldn't buy a T-Bond that will pay you 10,000 in 30 years for $10,000 today.

If you discount future earnings at 6% you get 1.8 millions for software engineering versus 2.67 million for NFL.

Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by x0x0 on Saturday February 03, 2018 @12:57AM (#16296410)
An safe investment with a 6% return is a fantasy.

30 year treasuries pay roughly 3% before inflation.

Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by JamesBarney on Saturday February 03, 2018 @03:13AM (#16296754)
A career is not as safe of an investment as a t-bond.
Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by jedberg on Friday February 02, 2018 @04:14PM (#16294241)
I'd much rather have 3 million in 4 years than 6 million in 40 years. I could grow the 3 million to well beyond 6 million after 40 years.
Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by JumpCrisscross on Friday February 02, 2018 @03:43PM (#16294047)
Average lifetime earnings are a terrible metric for entertainers, whose earnings are extremely exponentially distributed.
Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by avip on Friday February 02, 2018 @04:47PM (#16294458)
How so? Isn't sitting still for 9h/day way less healthy than playing professional sport?
Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by gbear605 on Saturday February 03, 2018 @09:24AM (#16297721)
Many (most?) NFL players walk away with horrific brain damage and extreme physical injuries. Sitting still for 9h/day certainly isn't great for your health, but there are things you can do to counteract it - go to the gym, for example. NFL players can't avoid those injuries.
Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by watwut on Friday February 02, 2018 @03:33PM (#16293972)
Part of it is also reward for risk - you have to train very hard for years before you can get to NFL. There is opportunity cost (to learn something else for example) with very low chance of getting in.

Compare it to programmers who are pretty sure to get job once they finish school, have plenty of time for activities outside of programming and have much lower pressure on them either at the job (NFL equivalent) or while preparing for it.

Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by x0x0 on Friday February 02, 2018 @02:45PM (#16293626)
1 - many players are not making millions a year. eg in 2017, two rookie quarterbacks in the playoffs were making $450k, the league minimum. All those average salary facts include eg Tom Brady.

2 - even at $1m/year, you may collect $550k after tax. Three years of that is not never work again money.

Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by criddell on Saturday February 03, 2018 @01:28PM (#16298781)
The median salary is $700,000. The average career lasts 3 years. Therefore you could say a typical player makes around $2 million playing football. That's gross. The net is probably about half of that. To most of America that will make an order of magnitude less than that in the same time, that sounds pretty good.
Re:I’m the Wife of a Former N.F.L. Player. Football Destroye... by ska on Friday February 02, 2018 @03:27PM (#16293935)

   Three years of that is not never work again money.
It's worth noting that three years of that gets you a bit over median household income at safe extraction (i.e. 4%) rate.

It's not FU money, but as an emergency fall back it is obviously plausibly never work again money.