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Re:How Apple fumbled a five-year lead in voice control by lobster_johnson on Monday January 29, 2018 @03:18AM (#16256135)
I'm probably living in a bubble, but I don't understand the current focus on all of these voice-operated AI things.

For one, I don't see anyone using them. I've never seen anyone use Siri on a phone, with one exception: I have a friend who uses voice transcription to write emails and text messages. (Not sure if that counts as Siri.) I don't know anyone who uses speakers such as Amazon Echo or Google Home, or mentions wanting them. I've used Siri on my phone a few times to try out silly things like asking about the weather or converting units, but it's seems so obviously bad that I've never tried going "Siri first". It's on my Apple TV, but I've not used it. Are people actually using this stuff as much as this article (and all the current focus on AI-powered speakers etc.) implies?

I'd love true AI -- a personal assistant that actually understood me, knew my tastes, remembered my choices and so on -- but that doesn't exist. So we get an uncanny valley where speaking to a device comes with uncertainty about whether the device will actually be able to service the request (see the numerous annoyed threads on Reddit about Siri not understanding incredibly basic things), requiring the user to carry around with them a mental model of the receiver's inadequacies. And we get that problem where many tasks that would be super useful to have done by an assistant is actually too difficult for a current AI. For example, booking a trip. I've never booked a flight that didn't involve pouring over pages of results, weighing the various compromises (optimizing for price vs departure time vs airport distance vs layovers vs airline crappiness etc.) and of course filling in a whole lot of information about myself. Let alone booking holidays (I spend many days on research for such a task). Bus and train tickets -- maybe, if it's a simple route with few variables. Dinner reservations and movie tickets, sure. Home automation, well. Once a home is fully outfitted with all lights, doors etc. being connected to a home automation system -- maybe. None of this is automated in my apartment, and I've never seen a home that is set up like this.

There's also the inherent limited utility that comes with an AI being unintelligent. For example, my Apple TV. I rarely know what I want to watch. To only rarely would I be able to say "Siri, play The Grand Budapest Hotel". Usually it would have to be something like "Siri, list me some sci-fi movies". But then I would still have to navigate the results. If it could respond to "Siri, show me French movies with an IMDb score of 7.0 or higher, or with a four-star review from Roger Ebert, that came out after 1990", well, now I'm interested. But somehow I doubt that those sort of multi-dimensional cross-referencing mechanics are currently available.

Edit: With the comments saying how good Google Assistant is compared to Siri, I tried it out. My first queries failed ("What is the weather in Washington State like in March") because it thought I was finished speaking and cut me off at "What is the weather", and showed me today's weather in my city. After a few attempts I got results, but then it returned Fahrenheit units (my phone is set to use metric/international units), and then it continued giving me Fahrenheit after I changed it, because apparently climate information is a "web search" returning text, not data: https://imgur.com/gallery/LI8Sc. Not so impressive. Meanwhile, Siri on the phone doesn't understand the query at all, ignoring the "in March" part and giving me today's weather, no matter how I phrase the question.

I can see a future where AI voice control is incredible, but it requires an enormous advance, and it seems like even the best AI of today just comes with frustration and failure. That's surely why companies like Apple and Google are working on this, but it doesn't explain, to me, why the current voice AI is being pushed so hard.

Re:How Apple fumbled a five-year lead in voice control by jsharf on Monday January 29, 2018 @03:37AM (#16256208)
I'm a software engineer. I code in vim and use Ubuntu on my desktop which I built myself. I say all of this to give the reader context for how I tend to interact with tech. I'm 24.

I do a lot of texting, and a lot of the time it's a mixture between plain old thumb texting and swiping for longer words. But about 30% of the time I use voice to text.

I use Google's assistant and the voice to text is excellent. It even uses context to go back and correct ambiguities (synonyms) and even cooler -- mistakes. If I say "I baked a match of cookies", it will first transcribe match, but as soon as I say cookies, it will in real-time go back and change match to what is obviously correct -- batch. Note this doesn't work with direct assistant commands ("okay Google what time is it?"),but it definitely does work with text messages you send while talking to the assistant ("okay Google, send Brandon a text message: I'm baking a match of cookies" gets corrected). This helps with stuttering or mistakes you make while speaking.

It's certainly a bit of a mental shift to get used to speaking text messages. Saying punctuation marks out loud is awkward. but it's definitely at the point where it's convenient.

Re:How Apple fumbled a five-year lead in voice control by jxdxbx on Monday January 29, 2018 @01:05PM (#16259311)
Transcription is a hard problem but it's pretty closed to solved. The unsolved problem is telling an voice assistant to do something useful and having it do it. An AI assistant would be something that could act on "Book me a trip to Tokyo and inform the relevant people," not interacting with a spoken command line, invoking some API by voice, or laboriously filling out a form by talking to a computer.
Re:How Apple fumbled a five-year lead in voice control by piyush_soni on Monday January 29, 2018 @03:45AM (#16256242)
On the other hand, in my experience most of the people who complain about voice operated AI being useless have been found using Siri. Google Assistant on the other hand works really great for me, and I use it all the time (in my phone, and with Google Home). I find it amazingly useful that I can ask my phone to check the time, my next meetings, while I'm shaving/taking bath/cooking or I'm just feeling lazy to get up and pick up the phone. Also, it is useful in setting reminders which I do a lot. I also send whatsapp/text messages using it or play YouTube videos/google play music just by asking the song I want. Sure, sometimes it doesn't recognize, but most of the times it does. It's incredible value addition for me. Just being able to ask a question in my natural voice without manually unlocking using a PIN etc. is so useful.
Re:How Apple fumbled a five-year lead in voice control by ardit33 on Monday January 29, 2018 @03:35AM (#16256199)
That's what I thought until i witness people in my family using: 1. Google voice and 2. Alexa (and raving about it)

I think tech people just find typing away much faster and voice interface kinda annoying, but a lot of more 'average type of users' really like the voice interface better.

I wouldn't have predicted, but voice is here to stay and it has long legs. It seems that casual home use, and in car (where the next battle will be) are the best uses of it, and not mobile/while out

Re:How Apple fumbled a five-year lead in voice control by lobster_johnson on Monday January 29, 2018 @03:47AM (#16256250)
How do people use those things?
Re:How Apple fumbled a five-year lead in voice control by acorkery on Monday January 29, 2018 @03:26AM (#16256165)
Yeah, it doesn't work well for me either. However my 6-year old son uses the Google assistant on my phone a lot. "Lego Ninjago Kai video please", "Play". "Why do dogs have tails?" That kind of thing.

I think it works brilliantly for certain narrow domains - answering factual questions, directions, distances, top rated attractions etc. And is quicker than typing and scrolling. But I agree the AI behind it has yet to demonstrate any real broad understanding - assimilating various contrasting opinions from text, providing context etc.

I also personally don't want to sit on a train, couch or a dentist waiting room listening to people talking to their phones or watches.

Re:How Apple fumbled a five-year lead in voice control by yodsanklai on Monday January 29, 2018 @03:46AM (#16256245)
> I don't understand the current focus on all of these voice-operated AI things

> I can see a future where AI voice control is incredible

It's not going to work overnight. I think it's great that apple integrated Siri in their product even though it wasn't very useful. There has been great progress in just a few years. I was skeptical too but I use it more and more. Things like "remind me to ...". "Play ...". I also use google voice quite often with my android TV box.

That being said, I'm always much faster with a keyboard. I prefer a smart text interface that understands basic actions, fuzzy search and so on.

Re:How Apple fumbled a five-year lead in voice control by kakarot on Monday January 29, 2018 @03:31AM (#16256188)
I use voice transcription out of necessity because my touch-screen is broken.

It would be pretty nice if it actually understood what I was saying instead of sometimes randomly capitalizing words and not offering a lowercase alternative when you press the word, and occasionally outputting something wildly phonetically different than its input.

I've come across several phrases that simply will not translate and must be entered manually.

Android, FWIW

Re:How Apple fumbled a five-year lead in voice control by toddh on Monday January 29, 2018 @10:43AM (#16258093)
I'm more in your camp, but I bought my dad an ipad for xmas and Siri has made all the difference with him. He's very smart but not computer literate, so the typing, tapping, apps, settings, app store—all that just confused him. Being able to control the ipad with voice really opened it up to him. Though I do get some weird emails now :-)
Re:How Apple fumbled a five-year lead in voice control by sevenfive on Monday January 29, 2018 @03:27AM (#16256170)
When I wake up in the middle of the night, I ask Siri what time it is, so I don't have to open my eyes.

That's about it.

Re:How Apple fumbled a five-year lead in voice control by JetSpiegel on Monday January 29, 2018 @03:43AM (#16256225)
Siri, Echo and the other voice-activated command lines without screen are not meant to be used by muggles, they fit the needs of Silicon Valley engineers and no one else. Maybe they can retrofit some parts into muggle-worthy products some day.
Re:How Apple fumbled a five-year lead in voice control by comstock on Monday January 29, 2018 @03:25AM (#16256161)
Can be useful when you’re looking after kids, you’re carrying a child/stuck away from your phone.

I’d guess voice assistance could be useful in other situations too. But for me the error rate still seems too high, and there are limited applications.