> Ubuntu has a bunch of telemetry stuff. And non-removable Amazon ad/apps that you've got to copy and paste commands into the system prompt to fix.

This is blatantly false. All Amazon stuff in Ubuntu is now opt-in only.

I did a fresh install of Ubuntu desktop the other day and there are Amazon icons on the sidebar by default. I didn't opt in unless it was maliciously bundled with another option.

There is a conflation of issues here. There's two separate Amazon things: (1) The launcher on the dock by default -- annoying but not subversive -- and (2) search integration, where your local searches would also query Amazon, which used to be enabled by default -- a privacy issue which caused some controversy a few years back. Great grandparent was talking about (2), specifically, so in that context I understood the grandparent to mean only it. However, the wording was certainly unclear if you weren't familiar with the controversy.

And not just downvoted but flagged... Anyways yeah, I tried Ubuntu out and the Amazon icon is there and isn't easily removed. Plus Unbuntu has auto-on telemetry or crash reporting as far as I understand.

Can I recompile Windows without any telemetry? Can I build my own Windows OS from scratch or install a pre-built one from a person or organization I trust?

You are correct, that pre-built machines are almost never trustworthy. That is not really important though, in that the very nature of GPLed Linux makes a huge difference to the user in terms of control of their machine.

This false-equivalence FUD is not compelling.

> Let's not pretend that if Linux ever got to the desktop in any meaningful way that these boxes wouldn't ship with everything including kernel modules to do "value added" nonsense.

Windows and Android are able to do these these things because of the lock-in they have on application developers. Apps made for Ubuntu run fine on other Linux distros so Canonical doesn't have the kind of control and lock-in which MS/Google/Apple. This equivalence is therefore dubious.

If Ubuntu started shipping on a lot of devices, the HP and other OEMs would start shipping value-adds from third parties as well. The title of this thread is "HP installs system-slowing spyware on its PCs". This by no means would be Windows-specific if HP shipped any serious quantity of consumer Ubuntu boxes.

> Apps made for Ubuntu run fine on other Linux distros so Canonical doesn't have the kind of control and lock-in which MS/Google/Apple.

Yes, that is the bug that these value adds would fix.

Please don't spread FUD. I'm not a huge fan of Ubuntu but be honest, its so-called telemetry drama from several years ago never required the command line to turn off, it was a switch in Unity's graphical settings app. Since that controversy it has always shipped opt-in, and non-Unity versions of Ubuntu never had the issue to start with. There are no Amazon "ads" apart from a link on the dock that is removed with a right-click, again no command line wizardry required.

Please don't lie.

This is incorrect. Every time I click the Unity button, the first icon is Amazon. No way to remove it that I can see. Just Launch. Please step me through clicking the top right Unity button to see all apps, then removing Amazon via the UI only.

The default in Ubuntu is to send crash reports: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Apport

It's a .desktop file just like any other icon in Unity. It's at /usr/share/applications/ubuntu-amazon-default.desktop; right click, delete, just like you would any other .desktop file.

While the Ubuntu telemetry stuff is now opt-in, your point still stands. What you describe is exactly what Android has become.

That’s the major difference, you can uninstall a package and it’s fixed. Big whoop compared to Microsoft.

You can always uninstall Windows and install a decent OS in its place.

If you don't like Ubuntu feel free to install any other Linux distro that doesn't include that stuff. I suggest Linux Mint.

This is an old troll in new clothing.

Back in the 1990s, people would claim that if Linux were used by anyone at all, it would be as buggy and insecure as Windows 95 was. Because bugs magically pop up due to use.

Now it's claiming telemetry magically pops up due to use. Plus ça change, I suppose.

On the other hand, the largest Linux distro by an order of magnitude (Android) is:

1. Locked down (so that you frequently can't even update to a newer release). 2. Has telemetry. 3. Has security bugs.

Android is only a "Linux distro" if you deliberately ignore all context in how people use that phrase.

No. I know what a Linux distro look like. I'm just saying that the only Linux that could have conquered the world, through HP, Compaq or Dell pre-installing Linux on the Desktop, would have looked more like Android than Debian.

Actually, it would have been worse, since at least Google is mandating some kind of inter-operability between OEMs together.

The main context needed is that Android is only a "Linux distro" when Linux fans talk about the installed base of Linux.

This is false.

Why this scaremongering? It's just an amazon affliate link.

A misguided attempt to make some revenue by canonical, who are broke and recently had to lay off a significant portion of employees.

Why this scaremongering? It's just a remote telemetry app.

A misguided attempt to make some revenue by HP, who are broke and recently had to lay off a significant portion of employees.