Re:‘I forgot my PIN’: An epic tale of losing $30,000 in bitcoin
by zwily on Monday October 30, 2017 @08:44PM
(#15590305)
The recovery key isn’t just used for recovery - every operation is derived from the recovery key. The device has to know it, in plaintext, in order to actually do anything.
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Re:‘I forgot my PIN’: An epic tale of losing $30,000 in bitcoin
by tptacek on Tuesday October 31, 2017 @12:01AM
(#15591010)
From the Trezor MCU source code on Github, it looks like I was right, and the PIN check is literally a string comparison.
Re:‘I forgot my PIN’: An epic tale of losing $30,000 in bitcoin
by zwily on Tuesday October 31, 2017 @12:25PM
(#15594417)
Yeah, I don't know why they do that. I was just responding to the decrypted key being stored in memory.
Re:‘I forgot my PIN’: An epic tale of losing $30,000 in bitcoin
by darkmighty on Monday October 30, 2017 @10:31PM
(#15590727)
> The device has to know it, in plaintext, in order to actually do anything
How so? You can use pins for encryption, I believe that's what tptacek was referring to.
If you use a strong key derivation function with an efficient hardware (i.e. within a few orders of efficiency limits of current generation), while using maybe 10J of energy, will economically protect at least about $1000, or $16000 with an 8 character pin. In practice significantly more because of hardware costs for a parallel attack, and the casual cracker wouldn't be willing to spend that much on a totally uncertain reward. At moderate hardware costs it could take years to crack.
Re:‘I forgot my PIN’: An epic tale of losing $30,000 in bitcoin
by zwily on Monday October 30, 2017 @11:03PM
(#15590834)
That's how they work - the PIN decrypts the encrypted seed key. However, after decryption, the seed key ("recovery key") is kept around in memory in order to actually be able to sign transactions/etc.
Re:‘I forgot my PIN’: An epic tale of losing $30,000 in bitcoin
by Scoundreller on Monday October 30, 2017 @11:15PM
(#15590866)
There are a few methods in which they could avoid keeping direct plaintext entries in memory that are difficult to extract without knowing the ROM code.
Re:‘I forgot my PIN’: An epic tale of losing $30,000 in bitcoin
by Scoundreller on Monday October 30, 2017 @09:26PM
(#15590483)
Maybe he's looking for one-way encryption ;)