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Re:Tungsten: The Perfect Metal for Bullets and Missiles (2014) by logotype on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @04:33AM (#15291733)
Funny to see this article here now. For the last few weeks I've been geeking out on exotic materials, and especially Tungsten Carbide. I even went so far to buy a polished Cobalt binded TC 70mm sphere from China. It's virtually indestructible and very few materials such as diamond can scratch it.
Re:Tungsten: The Perfect Metal for Bullets and Missiles (2014) by Tossrock on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @05:53AM (#15292042)
Carbide is hardly exotic. You can get < $20 drill bits made from it at your local hardware store.
Re:Tungsten: The Perfect Metal for Bullets and Missiles (2014) by rimliu on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @05:24AM (#15291921)
My wedding band is made of tungsten carbide. I thought about is as a bit different (neither my wife nor I are fond of gold) but certainly not exotic.
Re:Tungsten: The Perfect Metal for Bullets and Missiles (2014) by Steve44 on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @06:23AM (#15292194)
That's an unusual material for a ring, I just hope you don't get into the situation where it needs to be cut off. That would put me off using such a hard metal for rings and jewellery chains.
Re:Tungsten: The Perfect Metal for Bullets and Missiles (2014) by ckluis on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @07:02AM (#15292393)
First responders actually have a device which cracks tungsten rings (I have one), but they are easier “crack” than cut.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=poM423pewRE - “the home way”

https://www.loupe-magnifier.com/tungsten_finger_ring_removal... - “the professional way"

Re:Tungsten: The Perfect Metal for Bullets and Missiles (2014) by Steve44 on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @12:08PM (#15295342)
Interesting thank you. I'm still not sure I'd go for one but it's not as bad as I'd thought providing they know what they are dealing with.
Re:Tungsten: The Perfect Metal for Bullets and Missiles (2014) by refurb on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @11:29AM (#15294832)
You can also do it using a pair of Vise-grips. Just adjust the tool so that the closed mouth is slightly smaller than the ring. The ring will break but not hurt the finger.
Re:Tungsten: The Perfect Metal for Bullets and Missiles (2014) by VLM on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @09:46AM (#15293635)
My experience with metalworking indicates carbide endmills and inserts are incredibly brittle, slapping hand very hard against a brick (like high-fiving a brick wall) would probably shatter it.

If you drop an endmill (like a drill bit but different, about the size of your thumb) from a normal carrying height to a concrete floor, you'll almost certainly be buying a new endmill; much like dropped buttered toast always seems to land butter side down, a dropped end mill always seems to land point down and crack a big chip off. A ring should be lighter so less stress, and smooth would imply no stress concentration points, but I'd still be careful about impacts or dropping it.

Another anecdote is interrupted cuts on a metal lathe will shatter carbide seemingly instantly every time, you need to use "old fashioned" high speed steel to cut anything with a gap. I wonder if the vibration of taking a diamond tip engraver to a carbide ring would shatter the ring instantly.

An interesting anecdote is a rather large lump of carbide for a replaceable indexable cutter is a couple bucks and a rod of carbide turned into a polished sharpened precision endmill of a large size is only maybe $30. Possibly the ring could cost more because that specific type of carbide looks very nice or has been stress relieved or annealed somehow to make it less brittle, and of course there's the labor time of a professional jeweler if its custom work. But the raw material, unlike gold or Pt, can't cost more than perhaps $100 for a carbide ring.

Re:Tungsten: The Perfect Metal for Bullets and Missiles (2014) by logotype on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @06:59AM (#15292365)
You can't cut it. But the Carbide is brittle and with enough pressure it can shatter Carbide ring manufacturers have this in mind and intentionally make "weak points" on the ring so it can be removed in an emergency.
Re:Tungsten: The Perfect Metal for Bullets and Missiles (2014) by ajarmst on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @08:36AM (#15293006)
Mine too! I thought it made a nice statement about permanence or something like that. I was young. :-)
Re:Tungsten: The Perfect Metal for Bullets and Missiles (2014) by eloff on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @09:17AM (#15293370)
I got mine because it was just nerdy, and I liked the weight of it. Plus if I'm ever in a plane crash, I know at least a little bit of finger will survive.
Re:Tungsten: The Perfect Metal for Bullets and Missiles (2014) by lightedman on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @10:13AM (#15293913)
"It's virtually indestructible and very few materials such as diamond can scratch it."

Not really. It's a ceramic and as such will shatter if knocked against another ceramic, hardness notwithstanding. Also, for some reason, my skin eats away at it.

See my tungsten carbide ring vs my fiance's ring (mine is on the left) - both made before the requirement that the rings come with break points built-in - https://i.imgur.com/fSIOUJf.jpg

Note the differences - his ring looks brand new. Both rings bought at the same time, same maker, same style.

Mine's practically obliterated.

Re:Tungsten: The Perfect Metal for Bullets and Missiles (2014) by hwillis on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @11:12AM (#15294612)
Note that your ring is not really representative of real tungsten carbide. WC is a sintered material so the amount of binder (cobalt) and the size and makeup of the WC powder is extremely important. Even among tungsten inserts there are types designed for continuous turning and types for interrupted turning, which have a much higher toughness.

Toughness is what determines energy before breaking and note that while many ceramics are not at all tough, high end technical ceramics are tougher than most metals[1]. High quality WC is indeed tougher than steels. It's also twice as strong as most steel, but high-end steels surpass it in strength.

[1]: http://www.cam.ac.uk/sites/www.cam.ac.uk/files/news/research...

Re:Tungsten: The Perfect Metal for Bullets and Missiles (2014) by lightedman on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @01:38PM (#15296321)
"Toughness is what determines energy before breaking"

With ceramics and glass, things get a little tricky. You can take a relatively weak and softer piece of pottery ceramic and obliterate the hardened bullet-resistant windows on police cars (the laminate inbetween being a different matter, but the glass itself will shatter/crack.) That happens via ultrasonic frequencies created on impact.

Re:Tungsten: The Perfect Metal for Bullets and Missiles (2014) by hwillis on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @11:10PM (#15300319)
> With ceramics and glass, things get a little tricky. You can take a relatively weak and softer piece of pottery ceramic and obliterate the hardened bullet-resistant windows on police cars [...] That happens via ultrasonic frequencies created on impact.

All of that is wrong. You can't use pottery shards or even hard pebbles to break glass; you need very hard technical ceramics[1]. Spark plug ceramic is alumina which is extremely hard.

It has nothing to do with ultrasonic frequencies, it's caused by crack propagation. Tempered glass is under internal stress due to its quench rate and chemical treatment, so as soon as the outer shell is broken the entire thing shatters. Alumina is so hard that a corner can chip off a bit of glass, releasing that pressure.

Ceramics can't be tempered like glass, and like untempered glass they only shatter if an impact by a much harder object is above the fracture propagation energy. That means that most of the time the impact energy is about the same as the actual toughness of the material. For high toughness ceramics there are no materials hard enough to cause chipping, so they break exclusively under normal toughness.

[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ninja_rocks

Re:Tungsten: The Perfect Metal for Bullets and Missiles (2014) by lightedman on Thursday September 21, 2017 @02:09AM (#15300947)
"You can't use pottery shards or even hard pebbles to break glass; you need very hard technical ceramics[1]. Spark plug ceramic is alumina which is extremely hard."

Plenty of pottery contains aluminum oxide, which is very hard.

Re:Tungsten: The Perfect Metal for Bullets and Missiles (2014) by hwillis on Thursday September 21, 2017 @01:36PM (#15305729)
That's not the same thing- coal contains microscopic diamonds but you'll have a hard time scratching sapphire with it. Incidentally, alumina is much closer to sapphire than any pottery. Alumina is the sintered powder form and you need really good quality, high density stuff to be able to break a window. It's also a near-requirement that it has very sharp points.

Alumina will effortlessly scratch gorilla glass, any metal, tungsten carbide and even a lot of sapphire glass. No kind of pottery will do any of those things.

Re:Tungsten: The Perfect Metal for Bullets and Missiles (2014) by lightedman on Thursday September 21, 2017 @11:57PM (#15309291)
"coal contains microscopic diamonds but you'll have a hard time scratching sapphire with it."

Coal dust will abrade and destroy almost everything and it's because of the graphite, not the diamond. I have a coal mine. It's killed two phones and a drone already.

"Alumina will effortlessly scratch gorilla glass, any metal, tungsten carbide and even a lot of sapphire glass. No kind of pottery will do any of those things."

This is entirely untrue, it depends on the composition of the clay used in making the ceramic, which will be entirely dependent upon the location the clay or clay mix is obtained from. I also happen to do lapidary and pottery work, as a profession (next to LED lighting applications.) You can get clay from Mt. Baldy, make pottery, fire it up, it will scratch the hell out of almost everything because of the sand grain-sized rubies contained within.

Re:Tungsten: The Perfect Metal for Bullets and Missiles (2014) by italophil on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @10:31AM (#15294125)
It might not be your skin, but your skin care products. Some contain aluminium oxide or magnesium oxide. Both of these can oxide tungsten.
Re:Tungsten: The Perfect Metal for Bullets and Missiles (2014) by lightedman on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @01:32PM (#15296252)
My skin care products are the exact same as what my fiance uses.
Re:Tungsten: The Perfect Metal for Bullets and Missiles (2014) by dugditches on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @11:32AM (#15294880)
Be careful with rings made out of hard materials.

if you ever get into trouble it'll be your finger that comes off, not it.

Re:Tungsten: The Perfect Metal for Bullets and Missiles (2014) by gnur on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @05:08AM (#15291857)
Do you have a link for this? I have been interested in this as well, probably isn't cheap though?
Re:Tungsten: The Perfect Metal for Bullets and Missiles (2014) by logotype on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @05:25AM (#15291932)
Re:Tungsten: The Perfect Metal for Bullets and Missiles (2014) by logotype on Wednesday September 20, 2017 @05:19AM (#15291905)
It's not cheap. I contacted almost all suppliers worldwide, and in EU the price is roughly 2000-3000 EUR for a single sphere. However, one supplier in China called Sintec had in stock for a mere USD 375. It's a grade 50 sphere with a precision of a few thousands of a millimetres:)