c'mon they aren't the IT's crown jewel but you're doing a disservice to them. while products have accrued years of shit, as every old product does, it is extremely frustrating for very large enterprises and governments to talk with system integrators or even startup - most often than not their product is totally not ready to cope with the audit requirements, security requirements, they often don't even have a clue of what enterprises need on that front neither how to handle all the red tape around security certifications, legal requirements, disclosures requests that those clients usually have.

Reminds me of https://www.jwz.org/doc/groupware.html

Click that link from inside HN...

I knew what happens :)