Lawyer prices will obviously be different in different parts of the country, (so maybe a lot cheaper where you are) but I knew someone who arranged a transaction without a realtor and paid a lawyer a lot more than $1,000 to put together all the necessary documents. One thousand seems like a good deal.
>...which you generally need anyway when buying/selling a house.
You've found it necessary to always consult a lawyer when buying/selling even though realtors were involved? Why? What value did they add?
When you are signing your 20th piece of paper, you realize you needed the lawyer. One dirty secret of realtors is that all this work is handled by lawyers, and the impossible-looking parts of a real estate transaction are handled by lawyers who understand it and have it down to a fixed-price cookie-cutter process for their locality. They did "consult" with me a bit and gave some "free" advice, but I just paid the fix price for doc generation mainly.
When I say "you need a lawyer anyway", even if you used a realtor, a lawyer drew up the docs for closing, and you hired the lawyer who put together the closing docs, although you may not realize it. You are paying the lawyer directly as a line item in your closing costs, so they are technically "your lawyer." Most people think the realtor had something net-positive to do with the magic house-transfering documents, but, not really.
This may vary by state/locale.
Yea might be different where I am. Like any signed document, I am sure a lawyer somewhere created the templates for the selling agreement, the purchase agreement, the loan documents and closing documents etc but I don't recall seeing any line item for a lawyer's time on any document nor did I ever talk to a lawyer. (Thank goodness for this as a real estate lawyer I know charges about 400 an hour. Fortunately there is nothing unusual about most loans/purchases/closings and lawyers don't typically have to get involved in each transaction - around here loan processors, escrow officers, etc actually do the work and they are much less expensive than a lawyer would be.)
Title company? Blah, blah. Still goes through lawyer! I'm paying for this at the end.
SRSLY! I hate to be a dick but.... come on...
cooperate lawyer? Who cares?
The best part is that that same $3,200 will transfer a house that costs a lot more. The more expensive the house, the more you should want to use a lawyer over a realtor.
Yes, most brokers use standard forms, there isn't much actual expense there for them - which is a good thing because a real estate attorney I know bills at more than $400 per hour.
A good realtor does a LOT more than just fill out the contracts for you to sign. The realtor will spend lots of time scheduling inspections, helping find contractors, being at the property to watch contractors, scheduling the photographer, putting the ad on MLS, running open houses, answering questions from buyers, negotiating with buyers, working with the title company, arranging to hand the keys off to the buyer, etc, etc. You are paying for their experience to know what needs to be done and for the time it takes to do all those tasks that I mentioned (and others). The standard commission costs are high, but there are brokers like Redfin who are less expensive.
I don't understand the contractors statement, a contractor is not a usual part of a real estate transaction, at least in my experience?
Once again, scheduling photographs is a simple phone call to a photographer.
Putting an ad on the MLS can be done yourself for a small fee - https://fsbo.com/flat-fee-mls
Buyer's questions can be better answered yourself, most sellers agents are unable to answer any questions and they'll have to relay most questions to you anyways, once again, my experience.
Open houses are more about generating leads for the agent then they are about showing your house.
Negotiating with buyers can be done yourself easily.
Working with the title company isn't something real estate agents do, not around here anyways. My lawyer handled all the title stuff. Plus what sort of "work" does an agent need to do with the title company?
Handing off the keys? Seriously? That is done at closing and shouldn't cost $5,000+.
Yes obviously you can do that. But you have to take the time to research the different companies a little to find a good one and you have to be there while the inspection is done.
>...I don't understand the contractors statement, a contractor is not a usual part of a real estate transaction, at least in my experience?
In selling, often there are either things that come up on inspection that need to be fixed or improvements that are done to make the property sell better - new paint, new carpeting, etc. Obviously a seller can do this, but it takes time to get bids and to be at the house to let them in, etc.
>...Putting an ad on the MLS can be done yourself for a small fee - https://fsbo.com/flat-fee-mls
Yes, obviously this can be done, and yes you can also take the time to look at a number of listings and write the ad copy if you choose.
>...Buyer's questions can be better answered yourself, most sellers agents are unable to answer any questions and they'll have to relay most questions to you anyways, once again, my experience.
A good agent can save you time here.
>...Open houses are more about generating leads for the agent then they are about showing your house.
One way or the other, you need someone there during an open house. Either you have to be there or you need to pay someone to be there.
>...Negotiating with buyers can be done yourself easily.
Obviously a seller can negotiate themselves and maybe they are as good at negotiating and know as much about the local market as people who do this everyday and maybe they know the agents to avoid. Though maybe it isn't that uncommon that the seller hasn't sold many properties and is better off having someone else help them.
>...Working with the title company isn't something real estate agents do, not around here anyways. My lawyer handled all the title stuff. Plus what sort of "work" does an agent need to do with the title company?
Different situations in different parts of the country I guess.
>...Handing off the keys? Seriously?
In this part of the country, it is done later - agent meets the person at the house. Again, no reason you couldn't do it, but it is time out of your day.
>...That is done at closing and shouldn't cost $5,000+.
Not sure where the number comes from - there is no need to put words in my mouth. Simply listing some of the the things the agent did when my place was sold. If I had to take time off of work to try and handle all these details, it would have cost me a lot more than the commission the agent got.
You should ALWAYS be there when inspection is done. Always. You're paying for it after all. Research? Yes, you should regardless. I couldn't imagine not being there and/or not researching. Real estate agents are useless in this step. How does this have to do with an agent other than "can use the phone?"
Anything about the contractor, lol, yeah, doesn't happen in real life...
>it takes time to get bids and to be at the house to let them in, etc.
Nothing about a real estate transaction has anything to do with this.
> you can also take the time to look at a number of listings and write the ad copy if you choose
???? !!! ????? Wat!? LOL
How old are you!?!
>A good agent can save you time here.
LOL!!!! Yeah, this doesn't happen. Have you ever talked to a sellers agent??? LOL!!! Asking a basic question of a sellers agent = idk. I would laugh if it wasn't sad... Actually, I laugh anyways. If it isn't on the MLS, they don't have a clue.
>One way or the other, you need someone there during an open house. Either you have to be there or you need to pay someone to be there.
PROTIP - Your agent doesn't schedule an open house for you, she schedules an open house for her. Open houses are a lead generator, nothing more.
>agent meets the person at the house.
Wat!? At closing the keys are hand over. There isn't any other way. You're there anyways. Give me a break that agents try to justify their cost that ways??!!
$5,000+ comes from 3% of 200,000, which is $6,000.
Come on!! Give me a break!! I don't even hate agents but, for Christ sake, try harder!!
What you mean to say is that you can't imagine that things could be done differently than how it was done where you are located. That pretty much sums up every comment you made here...
You might lose out on a profitable bidding war, or the one customer who might buy the house coming through by doing that, but you might get an extra 2.5% if it works out.
A lot of the apparent value of realtors disappears when you do the process yourself. source: have FSBO bought, and FSBO sold, and redfin bought, and worked for Coldwell Banker.
Getting on the MLS is cheap/easy now with discount MLS listings--I wouldn't do fsbo without it, even though you usually pay buyer's agents.