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Re:My own private basic income by cortesoft on Wednesday June 28, 2017 @04:18PM (#14657918)
You are totally ignoring the crux of his argument, which is centered on ownership; how we decide who owns what, how we tax owned things versus earned-through-work things, and how we tax the things people do with what they own.

Yes, a piece of property earns rent because it has 'value' to someone else; however, who gets to earn that value? At some point, this piece of land was 'unowned', and then someone came along and said 'I own this'. Do we let them keep that forever? Do they have to pay society a fee for being able to claim it as their own? Can they give it to their kids for perpetuity? Can they do anything they want with it? What about the air above it, or the ground below?

These are all very important questions, and there isn't some 'true' moral answer to them that is the right way to govern property rights. There are easier moral arguments to make about ownership of property I produce, but not about land or natural resources.

Re:My own private basic income by AnimalMuppet on Wednesday June 28, 2017 @06:18PM (#14659013)
There aren't many people earning money as rentiers of unimproved land. But it turns out that people are much more willing to make improvements when they have secure title to the land.

But who gets to rent out the apartment building? Well, the one who put an apartment building there, that's who. Why should anyone else get to?

Re:My own private basic income by cortesoft on Wednesday June 28, 2017 @07:07PM (#14659368)
In many places, unimproved land has a TON of value. In those places, in fact, many people buy a home just to tear it down and rebuild on the lot. They would pay MORE if the house wasn't there. There is a reason the saying in real estate is 'location, location, location' and not 'build quality, build quality, build quality'. The reason you can buy much larger homes for less money in other parts of the country isn't because the building materials or labor are cheaper, but because the land itself is cheaper.

Now, I am not saying that the building itself doesn't have value, or that the person who built and owns the building shouldn't be compensated for that investment and work, but it is disingenuous to pretend that the majority of the value is from the building and not the land itself (at least for most places where rent is high)

I am not in any way, shape, or form arguing that we should seize all private property in some kind of communist revolution; I am simply saying we need to think about how we divide up the value of something like real estate to fairly compensate and encourage development without promoting unfair and ineffecient rent seeking.

Re:My own private basic income by bufordsharkley on Wednesday June 28, 2017 @09:59PM (#14660195)
Just as a note for those unfamiliar, there's a whole economic philosophy around the idea of utilizing land rents (and also all other rents) for public goods: Georgism.[0]

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Georgism

Re:My own private basic income by cookiecaper on Wednesday June 28, 2017 @06:24PM (#14659054)
>Do they have to pay society a fee for being able to claim it as their own?

In most areas, yes. There is a property tax that is charged as a percentage of the land's value. If the owner fails to pay this fee to society, society revokes his ownership, forcefully seizes the land if necessary, and resells the property to another person who is willing to pay the imposed fee.

Re:My own private basic income by int_19h on Thursday June 29, 2017 @12:45AM (#14660843)
One problem with property taxes is that they do not capture the ability (or inability) of the property to generate income - basically, whether and to what extent it is capital.

We also do have taxes on income produced by capital - that's capital gains - but, as the article points out, we tax them significantly lower than regular sweat-of-the-brow income, and offer more loopholes. In effect, our economic system incentivizes rent-seeking over labor.

Re:My own private basic income by cortesoft on Wednesday June 28, 2017 @06:59PM (#14659324)
Right, which means the real question is 'how much should those taxes be?'