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Re:Recent version of Handbrake download infected with malware by mikeash on Saturday May 06, 2017 @04:00PM (#14281967)
What's the alternative? Using different passwords for every account is not practical without some way to store them, and using the same password makes you even more vulnerable. We could write them all down in a big book or something, but that leaves us vulnerable to physical theft and loss.
Re:Recent version of Handbrake download infected with malware by arjie on Saturday May 06, 2017 @04:32PM (#14282098)
Theorycrafting without a real idea here but how about a physical device with private keys and challenge-response authentication from a site. To login you have to press a button to sign a specific message as a specific person.

Then they can't silently gain access to your account persistently. They can gain access until you logout but then they have to wait for you to login again. Or they can change the key but then you'd notice that you can't login.

Re:Recent version of Handbrake download infected with malware by andrewaylett on Saturday May 06, 2017 @06:37PM (#14282632)
Re:Recent version of Handbrake download infected with malware by rocqua on Saturday May 06, 2017 @04:39PM (#14282130)
To protect against password compromise in general, use 2 factor auth.

For this to really work, you need a way to detect compromise of the password. This way the 2nd factor holds you over until you've managed to rotate all important enough passwords.

Alternatively, separate trusted hardware with an interactive (i.e. challenge-response) protocol. Something like a TPM or yubikey.

Re:Recent version of Handbrake download infected with malware by codazoda on Saturday May 06, 2017 @07:57PM (#14282993)
Two options come to mind, neither perfect, but options.

1. Use a password pattern. Something like 8 random digits that you memorize and then part of the domain name or business name. Such as "goo" for google. Put them in whatever order you like. Now you've memorized one pattern but use a unique password everywhere.

2. Use a predictable algorithm instead of a password. Their are web based services for this. You enter the domain name and then "encode" it to a password. That is typically not reversible.

These fall down some when you have to change a password or when a system has requirements that don't match your password (like requiring a number or symbol). Other users will mention other limitations as well.

Re:Recent version of Handbrake download infected with malware by smichel17 on Saturday May 06, 2017 @08:45PM (#14283190)
I do #2 using master password app. https://ssl.masterpasswordapp.com
Re:Recent version of Handbrake download infected with malware by ProbabilityMoon on Monday May 08, 2017 @08:45AM (#14291019)
You made me curious so I tried this app. Unfortunately the UI is horendous. So far I tried the macOS, iOS, .jar and web version. Each version generates different passwords for the same site. This app has the most confusing UI I have seen in a long time, with each version being wildly different from the other. I still have no idea how to have multiple users for the same site, or even if setting the user makes a difference at all (seems not as it does not change the password). But most important: this app generates different passwords for the same input on different platforms. Kind of beats the purpose of having it in the first place.
Re:Recent version of Handbrake download infected with malware by tambourine_man on Saturday May 06, 2017 @10:28PM (#14283524)
That is an interesting idea. echo URL + password | sha/md5

Should be hard to crack and easy to remember.

Can anyone who actually knows this thing chime in?

Re:Recent version of Handbrake download infected with malware by danieldk on Sunday May 07, 2017 @02:20AM (#14284169)
That is an interesting idea. echo URL + password | sha/md5

There are 'stateless' password managers that work that way. It does not really protect against malware. If your user account is compromised by malware, what holds them from reading out your password and applying the same procedure to obtain password for interesting sites? You'll still be updating your password everywhere.

What you want is a second factor that uses a challenge-response mechanism with user interaction (e.g. U2F Yubikeys that require a finger press to start the challenge-response).

Re:Recent version of Handbrake download infected with malware by rdslw on Sunday May 07, 2017 @03:28AM (#14284313)
They can't. Prove me otherwise.

Even if they have plaintext password (which is often not case), this is just shasum. Feel free to guess which password (and which exactly scheme) I used to generate my password for news.ycombinator.com, if (of course it's now not like that :) it is:

bb05f766a74e6bf722136eaca97d9beb1fcc8f59d47c2d9e6eb1667d57c4cb82

You have now (after hacking whole hackernews db) access to my password ONLY for the hackersnews. Which was the original goal of the method: to use different passwords at different sites, which if compromised (password), do not reveal scheme used to generate it for different sites.

Re:Recent version of Handbrake download infected with malware by danieldk on Sunday May 07, 2017 @03:35AM (#14284333)
bb05f766a74e6bf722136eaca97d9beb1fcc8f59d47c2d9e6eb1667d57c4cb82

That's not the point. The malware would have access to your complete machine, possibly with root privileges, what holds them from reading your master password with a keylogger when you type it in?

It does not provide more security against trojans than a password manager.

Re:Recent version of Handbrake download infected with malware by rdslw on Sunday May 07, 2017 @11:44AM (#14285991)
You didnt read my reply nor the parent thread.

I was replying solely and only to the acusation that after revealing plain text password on one site (which was generated using said scheme) you disclose every one.

This is simply not true.

In addition (but I didnt address that), there is no single keychain/password store to steal by the trojan. I can use it anywhere, using only my head as a 'storage' machine.

Re:Recent version of Handbrake download infected with malware by tambourine_man on Sunday May 07, 2017 @09:45AM (#14285424)
The “password” in that command would be stored in your memory only, that's the benefit of this idea.
Re:Recent version of Handbrake download infected with malware by mikeash on Sunday May 07, 2017 @02:20PM (#14286711)
You'd have to enter it into your computer fairly frequently, and malware could capture it then.
Re:Recent version of Handbrake download infected with malware by jhasse on Sunday May 07, 2017 @06:24AM (#14284753)
Re:Recent version of Handbrake download infected with malware by Navarr on Saturday May 06, 2017 @04:19PM (#14282036)
Certificates, maybe?

You'd need a way to change your certificate though (and keep it to the same account).

Some system through DNS? I think I'm just slowly reinventing OpenID

Re:Recent version of Handbrake download infected with malware by rocky1138 on Saturday May 06, 2017 @06:10PM (#14282535)
Client side certificates are a thing but hardly anyone uses them because they are unwieldy.
Re:Recent version of Handbrake download infected with malware by xoa on Saturday May 06, 2017 @05:08PM (#14282270)
You now have 3 responses as of my comment and they're all worthless because they completely miss the point of Password Managers. PMs are not elegant, they are not ideal, their limits are very well known. They exist purely as a hack around the objective real world reality that authentication in general in the modern world completely sucks and depends on passwords. And that that reality is something we've got to live with and deal with for the foreseeable future.

Yes, we shouldn't have passwords for authentication at all, ever, period, and shouldn't have had them for at least a decade now. All the tech has long existed to switch to hardware backed public key cryptographic auth, and even to do so in a way that is far more user friendly then endless passwords and more secure at the same time, a sort of win-win that is quite unusual. We should all have HSMs (be it in the form of tokens, cards, compliant hardware in phones, or whatever) holding our private keys, and websites should only have our public certs. Entire classes of issues (like everything associated with password databases) would be perfectly and completely eliminated forever. There would be no dependence on any 3rd party services. Users would only need to remember at most a couple of PINs and that's it.

Back here on Earth though I can count every single site I've used in my life that had certificate based authentication and still have plenty of fingers left. Maybe U2F will make a bit more of a dent, but for a long time to come passwords will be the core of a lot of people's most critical personal security (like most of their money) and online identities. To have any value passwords need to be unique, and need to be fully random, and also have to deal with layers of extra crap that have been piled on top like password policies, arbitrary allowed characters (universal UTF? hahahaha), arbitrary minimum/maximum lengths, "security" questions (which should of course just be random strings lest they undermine the point of having a password but probably have their own special character restrictions), etc. Humans cannot remember all this garbage for more then a handful of sites. Password Managers are a practical solution to this mess of the "worst one except for all the other ones" variety. They effectively replicate (badly, but that's not their fault) some of what an actual decent key system would offer by default. They make attack scaling harder.

In short they're the best match to the most typical threat models most people face. Any good efforts to replace passwords period with keys is to be applauded, and if successful would eventually (years down the line) make password managers obsolete by making passwords themselves obsolete. But in the mean time password managers matter and people talking down at them due to issues that don't actually match general threat models are doing a terrible disservice to the public.

Re:Recent version of Handbrake download infected with malware by dsego on Saturday May 06, 2017 @07:52PM (#14282980)
A password generator perhaps, the one I use is http://getvau.lt .
Re:Recent version of Handbrake download infected with malware by deadbunny on Saturday May 06, 2017 @07:58PM (#14282998)
Or just use 2FA on your password db.