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Re:The F-35 still has a long way to go by WalterBright on Saturday April 01, 2017 @03:51PM (#14013819)
The trouble comes when the machine is too expensive to risk in combat, and cannot be replaced if it is lost. We saw this with battleships in WW2.
Re:The F-35 still has a long way to go by Redoubts on Saturday April 01, 2017 @04:00PM (#14013853)
And almost all of Germany v England in WWI
Re:The F-35 still has a long way to go by nradov on Saturday April 01, 2017 @08:19PM (#14014945)
The US Navy constantly risked their battleships (the ones that survived Pearl Harbor) in combat during WW2. They were right in the thick of every part of the Pacific campaign.
Re:The F-35 still has a long way to go by georgeecollins on Saturday April 01, 2017 @11:54PM (#14015676)
The US Navy risked its battleships and carriers because they were confident they could be replaced, via production and switching ships from the Atlantic to the Pacific. The German navy, in both wars, tended not to because they knew they couldn't replace them. The Bismarck was the exception that proved the rule. The Japanese did not really risk their best battleships until things were pretty desperate.
Re:The F-35 still has a long way to go by WalterBright on Saturday April 01, 2017 @09:10PM (#14015130)
The Bismarck and the Yamato in particular come to mind.
Re:The F-35 still has a long way to go by protomyth on Saturday April 01, 2017 @09:55PM (#14015329)
If you are looking for a WWII battleship that was too expensive to risk the Tirpitz is probably the best example. I think they let it out once.
Re:The F-35 still has a long way to go by Animats on Saturday April 01, 2017 @11:42PM (#14015640)
Tirpitz did get used a few times, but it was mostly useful as a way to tie up a big chunk of the Royal Navy. Eventually, Tirpitz was sunk by aircraft.

The US's four Iowa-class battleships were quite useful, mostly for shore bombardment. They required a huge crew, 2,700 for WWII, Korea), and, after some modernization, 1,800 in the 1980s and 1990s. It's the crew size that led to their retirement. Each turret needed 90-110 people.

There was naval interest in building some "bombardment ships" intended for shore bombardment of countries that didn't have a significant capability for shooting back. But that went nowhere, since most of the US's enemies in recent decades have been too far inland.

Re:The F-35 still has a long way to go by WalterBright on Sunday April 02, 2017 @12:20AM (#14015760)
The battleships proved incredibly vulnerable to aircraft. The Bismarck was disabled by a biplane, of all things.
Re:The F-35 still has a long way to go by NickNameNick on Sunday April 02, 2017 @12:24AM (#14015774)
The Tirpitz and also the major portion of the Italian fleet were able to exert disproportionate influence so long as they remained a potential threat.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fleet_in_being#World_War_II

Re:The F-35 still has a long way to go by gozur88 on Sunday April 02, 2017 @05:16AM (#14016527)
The Bismarck was sunk moving to its theater of operations. The Germans were very much planning to use it as a commerce raider, and it would have been a big problem for the allies in that role.

The Japanese government was afraid to send the Yamato into battle, but that had nothing to do with money (after all, its sister ship was deployed at the 2nd battle of Leyte Gulf). The problem was they'd used it as a centerpiece in their war propaganda, and they thought losing it would be a PR disaster that outweighed any possible utility in battle.

Re:The F-35 still has a long way to go by WalterBright on Sunday April 02, 2017 @04:00PM (#14018750)
A few airplanes sunk the Yamato. It would have been far more effective if the Japanese had sunk (!) that money into better aircraft and better pilot training.
Re:The F-35 still has a long way to go by gozur88 on Sunday April 02, 2017 @04:36PM (#14018913)
They had great pilots and great aircraft at the start of the war, but by the time Yamato was sunk it was all gone. They didn't even have enough fuel for a round trip - they were going to ground her and use her as a fixed gun emplacement.
Re:The F-35 still has a long way to go by WalterBright on Sunday April 02, 2017 @09:56PM (#14020142)
> They had great pilots and great aircraft at the start of the war

A handful. Nowhere near enough. The Battle of Midway wiped out the bulk of them. The Zero rapidly became obsolete, too.