Google Talk Is Being Discontinued

Re:Google Talk Is Being Discontinued by icebraining on Friday March 24, 2017 @05:38PM (#13952441)

My point is that companies forced to do this would create abstruse formats, and then even misimplement them, to thwart those trying to interoperate.

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Re:Google Talk Is Being Discontinued by pbhjpbhj on Friday March 24, 2017 @07:47PM (#13953171)

Which would be obvious, flout the law, and allow for legal action to be taken.

The company itself has to use the format for live message exchange, have to publish a full working protocol document.

With OOXML Microsoft aren't required to be able to read & write a files correctly when it's written to the protocol. As I envisage it the requirement would be to open the protocol actually used "on the wire"; again with Word Microsoft don't use OOXML as primary.

I think it's workable except perhaps in requiring political will. It's an internet age equivalent of allowing third-party car parts manufacture.

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Re:Google Talk Is Being Discontinued by icebraining on Saturday March 25, 2017 @03:44AM (#13954525)

Will it be obvious? How? Browsers often fail to implement open standards like CSS, even when they have nothing to gain, it's just that shit's hard.

Microsoft don't use OOXML as primary.

Sure they do, that's what .docx files are. They've been the default since Office 2007.

Microsoft was compelled to create and implement the standard so that governments can comply with their requirements to use "open standards". And they followed all the steps, including getting it past ISO, despite the mess that the format is. And so governments can now tick the "open formats" box when purchasing Office. It's all a sham, and I don't see how it'd be otherwise with this proposed law.

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Re:Google Talk Is Being Discontinued by nickpsecurity on Friday March 24, 2017 @07:30PM (#13953090)

Oh yeah. They'll probably try that. That will either be defeated with tons of sweat as it largely was in products like OpenOffice or the legal recommendation modified to attempt to deal with it. It might also be handled in the courts if the law includes language that specifically instructs to attempt simple, readable protocols to "facilitate interoperability." Obfuscations could be argued as the opposite of that in court.

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Re:Google Talk Is Being Discontinued by icebraining on Saturday March 25, 2017 @03:58AM (#13954558)

That will either be defeated with tons of sweat as it largely was in products like OpenOffice

Then why do you need open standards? Every major proprietary IM protocol has been re-implemented by open source software, including Hangouts: https://bitbucket.org/EionRobb/purple-hangouts

It might also be handled in the courts if the law includes language that specifically instructs to attempt simple, readable protocols to "facilitate interoperability.

XMPP, the thing Google is being roasted for dropping support for, is often decried as being very complex and hard to implement correctly. If genuinely open protocols often end up like this, how can you possibly punish companies for writing complex, hard to implement protocols?

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Re:Google Talk Is Being Discontinued by nickpsecurity on Sunday March 26, 2017 @12:46AM (#13959204)

"Then why do you need open standards?"

"This is to prevent or reduce lockin, walled gardens, etc."

What I said. I'll add that it's hard to copyright API's to sue over compatibility when the API's and their implementation are released as open-source software.

"If genuinely open protocols often end up like this"

What are you talking about? There's all kinds of results from protocol design. You chose one of the worst ones. I was a PSYC fan over that if I had to choose an IRC replacement or open chat standard. A test for new ones might be trying to run it through LANGSEC's Nail, Cap n Proto or ZeroMQ to see if they handle it easily. Anyway, it's easier to do compatible implementations if you have source and can't be sued/imprisoned for imitating it.

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