Perhaps I'm overly paranoid, but I think moving out first, then getting all uppity with gov't is probably a saner route.

He's posted below that his business is not registered, so there is nothing to get uppity about.

Also, after moving out there is not much to gain from the situation any more so any time you invest in to getting 'uppity' is wasted.

On another note, I wonder how much of the paranoia is really warranted and how much of it is based on media hype, I have two friends working in China and they're managing to get along with government officials well enough, so far, even when they're critical.

Does anybody from China have any experience with 'getting uppity' with Chinese officials as a foreigner doing business in China? As in "Hi, I need this to do my work, can you provide it or will I have to leave?" (which doesn't sound all that uppity to me anyway).

edit: by the way, funny the moderation in this thread is making me wonder how many people on HN have an irrational fear about all things Chinese. They can't all be moderating out of personal experience.

You don't get "uppity" with Chinese officials. You either have a good connection to the government or you can do squat. Government ties is everything if you really want to get your business going.

The real problem is the international companies providing all this nifty IT tech to actually realize this 1984 path what is going on in China.

I've worked inside various China government departments. In many respects, they have less data on China citizens than the U.S. government has access to on U.S. citizens.

If China is on a "1984 path", all I can tell you is the U.S. and UK are ahead of them at the moment in terms of data collection.

As to needing to be an insider to get your business going. This is only true for certain types of business. For those types, as a foreigner, you'd do well to stay out of it anyway, without regard to how connected you are.

China still takes the lead in censorship.

I wouldn't bet on that. The US is full of 'self-censors', and that in a way is even more chilling.

Yes, they're a real pain. I don't think it is as much that they don't realize it, they just see it as a way to make money. Take Cisco for example: http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2008/05/leaked-cisco-do/

All of the equipment is manufactured in China anyway... Why would they not sell to the Chinese government when the alternative is for the government to get the unbranded equipment that is manufactured when the factory is "offline". :P

Please name names.

Cisco, Nortel (now Avaya).

source: http://www.corpwatch.org/article.php?id=4854

There may be others though.

Actually I came here because my wife missed home, and the business isn't official(that is, isn't registered which because I'm not Chinese takes a lot of time and money and could very well be flat out rejected, have a read of some posts at China Law Blog http://www.chinalawblog.com/ , they cover the details).

Basically this is something I've just gone ahead and started, will work my ass off to make work, and if it does, and is worth while then I'll go official.

Ok. how about your own very private VPN to a machine abroad somehwere ?

I'm willing to host it for free for you if you play nice just to get you out of the bind you're in.

Mail me if you're game.

Ok, mailed you back with access info, hope you got it!

Got it, thanks, working great.

One down, one billion to go? :)

My wife is Chinese as well. She manages our China company. We're registered as an IT company. Its not a WOFE, but a full Chinese entity with only Chinese shareholders, which has some benefits. I'm the General Manager of the company.

Good luck with your business. I do recommend getting a company in order as soon as you can afford it. For the most part, so long as you are not cheating the tax man, you can get away with operating without proper company structure for a while. Also, when you do setup a company...shop around different districts for tax deals. Some districts in Shanghai, for example, may give you a lower tax rate to encourage your type of business. IT is usually a preferred business type.

Tax breaks here can be meaningless. One city gave a tax break on profits for the first (I think) three years in new businesses set up by foreigners. Hey, any business that can make money within 3 years is already being done by locals.