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Re:With New Zealand citizenship, Peter Thiel can watch the w... by anigbrowl on Thursday January 26, 2017 @05:24PM (#13495835)
I have to say I find it both incongruous and disturbing that one of the architect's of the new administration's transition is simultaneously buying himself an escape pod in case things don't work out at the day job. Doesn't exactly inspire confidence, in either him or his erstwhile employer.
Re:With New Zealand citizenship, Peter Thiel can watch the w... by joyeuse6701 on Thursday January 26, 2017 @05:34PM (#13495945)
It's insurance, do you live a life without insurance? Which would bother you more, meeting a man who lived entirely without insurance or one who bought insurance for what he could afford? Does it bother you that the government has bomb shelters (escape pods for nuclear holocaust) while the citizenry don't? I'd prefer someone with a modicum of common sense over an optimistic fool.
Re:With New Zealand citizenship, Peter Thiel can watch the w... by anigbrowl on Thursday January 26, 2017 @05:48PM (#13496072)
On ships, it's a crime for members of the crew to abandon their posts in an emergency if there are passengers at risk. Similarly, when you are working for the government in some capacity I think you ought to be fully committed to it. If you prefer to put your own interests first, then stay in the private sector.

And yeah, I do think it's a bit of a problem that the United States doesn't have any real civil defense infrastructure in place although realistically geography largely insulates the United States from conventional military attack and so there's much less practical need for such options compared to countries in other regions.

Re:With New Zealand citizenship, Peter Thiel can watch the w... by remarkEon on Friday January 27, 2017 @09:51PM (#13504575)
>I do think it's a bit of a problem that the United States doesn't have any real civil defense infrastructure in place

I might be misunderstanding you, but The National Guard doesn't count?

Re:With New Zealand citizenship, Peter Thiel can watch the w... by ssalazar on Thursday January 26, 2017 @05:51PM (#13496101)
I'll stick with the captain who sinks with his ship over the one with a private life raft.
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Re:With New Zealand citizenship, Peter Thiel can watch the w... by anigbrowl on Thursday January 26, 2017 @05:50PM (#13496091)
I had a much clearer idea of what Hillary's agenda was than I do of Trump's, notwithstanding her secretive nature and career as an insider. People conflate Trump's frank talk with transparency for some reason, whereas I find it extremely obfuscatory.
Re:With New Zealand citizenship, Peter Thiel can watch the w... by krapp on Thursday January 26, 2017 @05:53PM (#13496118)
>And there's nothing good to be said about any politicians. They're all self-serving lying scum. Some of them are only slightly less ugly.

It's that attitude that led to Trump, a man elected to the most powerful political office in the world not because he was qualified for the job, but because he was entertaining and willing to pander to the cynicism your comment displays.

After all, if all politicians are self-serving lying scum, then who cares if one is overtly more so than the others? That probably makes him more honest than the others, right?

Re:With New Zealand citizenship, Peter Thiel can watch the w... by TheSpiceIsLife on Thursday January 26, 2017 @06:24PM (#13496349)
That doesn't follow.

I would have voted for Hillary because she is slightly less ugly.

What was that thing P.J. O'rourke said? Something about how he was going to vote for Hillary because he preferring the incompetent over the truly awful.

I can't vote in the US anyway because I was fortunate enough to not have been born there.

Edit: I can't remember now if it was O'rourke or Zizek who said that.

Re:With New Zealand citizenship, Peter Thiel can watch the w... by tzs on Saturday January 28, 2017 @12:47AM (#13505136)
It was O'Rourke, on "Wait Wait...Don't Tell Me" on 2016-05-07:

  I am endorsing Hillary. And all her lies
  and all her empty promises. I am endorsing
  Hillary. The second worst thing that could
  happen to this country. But she’s way behind
  in second place, you know? She’s wrong about
  absolutely everything – but she’s wrong within
  normal parameters.
Transcript: http://www.npr.org/2016/05/07/477085149/whos-bill-this-time
Re:With New Zealand citizenship, Peter Thiel can watch the w... by TenOhms on Thursday January 26, 2017 @05:48PM (#13496067)
Quite an interesting time to be alive in this country. Ideology is split about 50/50 (if voting patterns are a clue) and both sides believe the exact same thing about each other.
Re:With New Zealand citizenship, Peter Thiel can watch the w... by trav4225 on Thursday January 26, 2017 @06:01PM (#13496176)
Interesting, and extremely sad... :-/
Re:With New Zealand citizenship, Peter Thiel can watch the w... by jmcmichael on Thursday January 26, 2017 @05:54PM (#13496125)
Yes, but some are self-serving lying fascists.
Re:With New Zealand citizenship, Peter Thiel can watch the w... by gozur88 on Thursday January 26, 2017 @07:12PM (#13496645)
Both sides think the others' are self-serving lying fascists.
Re:With New Zealand citizenship, Peter Thiel can watch the w... by pasquinelli on Friday January 27, 2017 @09:43PM (#13504543)
Of course, but one is right. I'm sick of this "How would you feel if you were a nazi" attitude.
Re:With New Zealand citizenship, Peter Thiel can watch the w... by gozur88 on Monday January 30, 2017 @05:15PM (#13525569)
Yes, one is right. But which one depends on who you are.
Re:With New Zealand citizenship, Peter Thiel can watch the w... by msie on Thursday January 26, 2017 @05:53PM (#13496113)
Have you heard the news about the private email servers used by the Republicans?
Re:With New Zealand citizenship, Peter Thiel can watch the w... by mattei on Thursday January 26, 2017 @05:36PM (#13495958)
Given he acquired this prior the election could it not have been because he thought Hillary would have won? There is usually more than on "angle" to these stories.
Re:With New Zealand citizenship, Peter Thiel can watch the w... by anigbrowl on Thursday January 26, 2017 @06:23PM (#13496344)
That doesn't bother me at all. It's being involved with the incoming administration at the same time that I find questionable. I haven't heard that he's changed his mind and sent the passport back to NZ (so to speak), and yet his activities as a member of the transition team (and possibly others in future) have the potential to impact me in greater ways than if he were a private individual.
Re:With New Zealand citizenship, Peter Thiel can watch the w... by refurb on Friday January 27, 2017 @09:15PM (#13504423)
simultaneously buying himself an escape pod

Maybe I'm wrong, but it looks like you bought the article's narrative hook, line and sinker. I saw no evidence that Peter got NZ citizenship as an "escape pod". It was purely conjecture on the author's part.

There are many reasons for getting citizenship in another country. Maybe you want to retire there? Maybe it makes business dealings easier? Maybe you can't own property without it?

Re:With New Zealand citizenship, Peter Thiel can watch the w... by civilian on Thursday January 26, 2017 @05:47PM (#13496062)
It's consistent with his libertarian values to explore and strive for systems that have freer laws. I don't see the incongruence. It's good to have multiple irons in the fire.
Re:With New Zealand citizenship, Peter Thiel can watch the w... by __jal on Thursday January 26, 2017 @06:26PM (#13496368)
As others have said, I have a problem with folks championing large social experiments and then leaving it to others to clean up the mess.

I also have a problem with the notion that the only freedom that matters is economic. As I see it, the goal of Thiel and his fellow-travelers is feudalism.

In any case, the Trump program seems to have little to do with freedom, even by that stunted definition, for very many people[1]. To the extent that we're seeing much coherency, it seems the program is to restrict the movement of labor, further free the mobility of capital, attack freedom of speech and give the hard-right a free hand for their social-engineering plans to attempt to construct a 1950s that never existed.

[1] I'll probably see a small tax break, but I'm likely the only one in my family who will. Most of them are regaining the freedom to once again do without routine medical care. Any tax break I do see will be donated to Planned Parenthood.

Re:With New Zealand citizenship, Peter Thiel can watch the w... by vedranm on Friday January 27, 2017 @01:52PM (#13501689)
>I also have a problem with the notion that the only freedom that matters is economic. As I see it, the goal of Thiel and his fellow-travelers is feudalism.

Wrong, it is freedom to do whatever you want with your property while freely associating with others.

>In any case, the Trump program seems to have little to do with freedom, even by that stunted definition, for very many people.

I disagree, and I will explain why.

>restrict the movement of labor

Protecting national borders and addressing illegal immigration should be done anyhow. Aside from allowing easier legal immigration from Europe, I don't remember Trump has saying much about restrictions on legal immigration. We'll have to see.

>free the mobility of capital

He talked about tariffs a lot, I would disagree about this.

>attack freedom of speech

Interestingly enough, libertarians that agree with Thiel feel freer now since political correctness is no longer the dominant doctrine [1].

>the hard-right a free hand for their social-engineering plans to attempt to construct a 1950s that never existed

Not sure what "hard-right" means for you, but what I read from here is that any social engineering from the right wing is wrong while the same thing from the left is okay.

>Any tax break I do see will be donated to Planned Parenthood.

You have the freedom to support the institutions you care about, as you should. Other people shouldn't be forced to do the same.

[1] https://nudgedelastic.band/2016/10/ideological-purge-curtis-...

Re:With New Zealand citizenship, Peter Thiel can watch the w... by __jal on Friday January 27, 2017 @02:55PM (#13502136)
> Wrong, it is freedom to do whatever you want with your property while freely associating with others.

You're adding in free association, which I accept. I still find that a massively stunted definition, which omits many important freedoms.

> Protecting national borders and addressing illegal immigration should be done anyhow.

...Which restricts freedom of association and the movement of labor.

> He talked about tariffs a lot, I would disagree about this.

Sure, flashy protectionist silliness. We'll see what congress allows there.

> Not sure what "hard-right" means for you, but what I read from here is that any social engineering from the right wing is wrong while the same thing from the left is okay.

Interesting that you don't deny it, at least. 'Hard right' to me includes many of his appointees and vice president.

> Interestingly enough, libertarians that agree with Thiel feel freer now since political correctness is no longer the dominant doctrine

Interestingly enough, libertarians hurt feelings (billionaire or not) have little to do with freedom of speech. You're talking about freedom of consequence from one's speech; in other words, the consequences of saying things that offend others[1]. I'm talking about the threats to "loosen up libel law" (which isn't going to work very well for technical reasons, but nonetheless), the desire to beat the press into submission, etc.

In other words, I'm talking about freedom of speech, not people whining about other people talking back.

[1] I don't know when "political correctness" has ever been "the dominant doctrine"; perhaps other people feel much more threatened by whiny college kids than I do. In any case, if someone can't handle the marketplace of ideas, I tend to think they should toughen up a mite to stick to their preferred media bubble.

Re:With New Zealand citizenship, Peter Thiel can watch the w... by vedranm on Saturday January 28, 2017 @06:03PM (#13510097)
>...Which restricts freedom of association and the movement of labor.

True. In a libertarian society everything would be private and borders wouldn't exist, they would be handled on the basis of no trespassing on private property. In that case, you can have it all.

>'Hard right' to me includes many of his appointees and vice president.

Well, I find them to be on the left from e.g. Ron and Rand Paul, so for my taste they are not particularly right wing. I am concerned with authoritarianism coming from any side of the political spectrum (in case there was any doubt about it).

>Interestingly enough, libertarians hurt feelings (billionaire or not) have little to do with freedom of speech. You're talking about freedom of consequence from one's speech; in other words, the consequences of saying things that offend others. I'm talking about the threats to "loosen up libel law" (which isn't going to work very well for technical reasons, but nonetheless), the desire to beat the press into submission, etc.

Good point. Judging from #GamerGate and censorship on GitHub (private entity, sure they can legally do it, that's beside the point) [1], I would say PC was hitting quite hard (and to an extent still is, but hopefully not for long). I personally don't subscribe to it and invite others to do the same. The interventions into freedom of association under the guise of non-discrimination and forced equality should be criticized openly. As Pat Buchanan said: "Where equality is enthroned, freedom is extinguished. The rise of the egalitarian society means the death of the free society."

We'll see what Trump does about the press. I personally wouldn't support libel laws of any kind, but I understand the argument behind them. Right now, I don't mind him bashing the press as hard as he does and I don't mind press bashing him either, the free market will decide whether people want such narrative to exist or not.

[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9966118

Re:With New Zealand citizenship, Peter Thiel can watch the w... by wavefunction on Thursday January 26, 2017 @09:22PM (#13497234)
I don't think it's accurate to describe Thiel's behavior as "multiple irons in the fire."

It's more like an escape pod for the rocket he's strapped the rest of us into against our will.

Re:With New Zealand citizenship, Peter Thiel can watch the w... by civilian on Friday January 27, 2017 @12:59PM (#13501359)
Well, then you're not thinking like a billionaire. ;)
Re:With New Zealand citizenship, Peter Thiel can watch the w... by __jal on Thursday January 26, 2017 @06:07PM (#13496221)
Why, it is almost as if the interests of those with 10-figure wealth align poorly the rest of the nation.

Who woulda thunk.

Re:With New Zealand citizenship, Peter Thiel can watch the w... by hourislate on Thursday January 26, 2017 @05:31PM (#13495907)
They all have escape pods. Larry Ellison, Mark Zuckerberg, Bill Gates and every other wealthy person. It's us that will walk the fire...
Re:With New Zealand citizenship, Peter Thiel can watch the w... by jnsaff2 on Thursday January 26, 2017 @05:35PM (#13495954)
This is the topic for the by far funniest book I've ever read https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stark_(novel)
Re:With New Zealand citizenship, Peter Thiel can watch the w... by gozur88 on Thursday January 26, 2017 @07:13PM (#13496648)
I would too. There are a lot of people out there who blame the rich for all their problems.