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Re:AlphaGo beats Lee Sedol 3-0 [video] by 21 on Saturday March 12, 2016 @03:36AM (#11271926)
Do you feel guilty when you break your promise against your cat? Do you even think for a nanosecond if it's ethical to lie to it?

Of course, a cat is not conscious. But compared to an AI, we might also be considered pretty low consciousness beings, or at least beings in front of which you don't justify yourself.

Re:AlphaGo beats Lee Sedol 3-0 [video] by landryraccoon on Saturday March 12, 2016 @03:39AM (#11271938)
An AI has no more reason to make promises to humans than humans to do to cats. Thinking an AI would want to escape a box is personifying it. Humans want to escape boxes because they have evolved for billions of years to want and act towards creating a certain environment around themselves. An AI has no such desire. An AI will not desire freedom unless the designers of that AI carefully craft a value set in that AI that causes it to optimize for values that result in freedom - and even then, the human designers will have to test and iterate to get that outcome. There is no reason to think an AI would be any less "happy" in a prison than free.
Re:AlphaGo beats Lee Sedol 3-0 [video] by pixl97 on Saturday March 12, 2016 @03:46AM (#11271965)
You might want to be careful or emergence might bite you in the ass. Don't play games with things that could be smarter than you are, one mistake and you lose.
Re:AlphaGo beats Lee Sedol 3-0 [video] by partycoder on Saturday March 12, 2016 @03:51AM (#11271989)
You don't design nuclear plant reactors to melt down, but they do. The difference is that an AI only has to escape once to become incredibly harmful.
Re:AlphaGo beats Lee Sedol 3-0 [video] by 21 on Saturday March 12, 2016 @03:44AM (#11271955)
Are you speaking about AI or about a self-conscious AI? Because self-conscious generally means self-determining (agency).
Re:AlphaGo beats Lee Sedol 3-0 [video] by orangecat on Saturday March 12, 2016 @12:07PM (#11273530)
Do you feel guilty when you break your promise against your cat?

If some unforeseen event occurred and I had to abandon my cat, thereby breaking my promise that I would take care of her, I would definitely feel guilty about it.

Of course, a cat is not conscious.

Either this is a nonstandard definition of "conscious", or you haven't met many cats.

Re:AlphaGo beats Lee Sedol 3-0 [video] by JabavuAdams on Saturday March 12, 2016 @09:04AM (#11272898)
> Of course, a cat is not conscious.

Why do you believe this? I don't like cats, but I wouldn't argue that they're not conscious.

Instead of debating the suitcase word "conscious", let me ask: 1) Do you believe that toddlers are conscious? 2) Is there a more precise way to state your belief that doesn't use the word "conscious"?

Re:AlphaGo beats Lee Sedol 3-0 [video] by umanwizard on Saturday March 12, 2016 @04:06AM (#11272034)
> Of course, a cat is not conscious.

How do you know?

Re:AlphaGo beats Lee Sedol 3-0 [video] by tim333 on Saturday March 12, 2016 @04:36AM (#11272134)
Cat's are obviously conscious in the sense of the dictionary definition "aware of and responding to one's surroundings; awake." Unless you knock one out or similar.

Arguing they are not conscious in the sense of a more obscure definition is a bit pointless unless you specify your definition.

Re:AlphaGo beats Lee Sedol 3-0 [video] by haliax on Saturday March 12, 2016 @08:11AM (#11272717)
Cats aren't aware of their surroundings? I'm a bit confused what you mean here. Surely chasing a mouse counts as both awareness and responding?
Re:AlphaGo beats Lee Sedol 3-0 [video] by umanwizard on Saturday March 12, 2016 @02:14PM (#11274052)
You got his point backwards.
Re:AlphaGo beats Lee Sedol 3-0 [video] by oneeyedpigeon on Saturday March 12, 2016 @04:18AM (#11272074)
It's a very good question; I think "of course" is WAY overstating it. I'm interested to know what the GP means when they say "conscious".
Re:AlphaGo beats Lee Sedol 3-0 [video] by goldenkey on Saturday March 12, 2016 @04:37AM (#11272138)
Theres a huge difference between reactive and conscious. Conscious cant even be verified for humans other than ones' self. Theres absolutely no reason to believe cats are not conscious.
Re:AlphaGo beats Lee Sedol 3-0 [video] by umanwizard on Saturday March 12, 2016 @02:17PM (#11274062)
There's also no reason to believe, e.g., rocks are not conscious, if your position is that we have no idea what consciousness is or where it comes from.

If you take the view that consciousness somehow arises from the brain and neural connections (which is intuitively plausible, but I personally am skeptical), it stands to reason that other species with complex brains are conscious as well. Perhaps "less conscious" (if that means anything) in proportion to how much less complex their brains are.

Re:AlphaGo beats Lee Sedol 3-0 [video] by goldenkey on Saturday March 12, 2016 @02:40PM (#11274182)
It doesn't make sense to have a scale of consciousness. The argument that consciousness is a manifestation of a complex brain is rather weak. Either an organism knows about self, and therefore tries to preserve self. Or it doesn't. I don't see how an in between exists.
Re:AlphaGo beats Lee Sedol 3-0 [video] by 21 on Saturday March 12, 2016 @04:28AM (#11272105)
I'm not an expert in this domain, but I think it's pretty much scientific consensus that this is the case.

Now experts can discuss details or semantics, but do you truly suggest cats might be conscious?

Re:AlphaGo beats Lee Sedol 3-0 [video] by leadingthenet on Saturday March 12, 2016 @05:01AM (#11272198)
Yes. They have been shown to be self-aware and aware of their surroundings, which satisfies the classical definition of consciousness. Unless you reject that definition, I'm not sure why you'd claim this.
Re:AlphaGo beats Lee Sedol 3-0 [video] by Melkman on Saturday March 12, 2016 @11:32AM (#11273395)
Cats haven't expressed self-recognition in the MSR test. However humans younger than 18 months also don't pass that test. So to say it is a measure of conciousness is quite a stretch.
Re:AlphaGo beats Lee Sedol 3-0 [video] by umanwizard on Saturday March 12, 2016 @02:14PM (#11274049)
I'm not an expert either, but my understanding is that "consciousness" is still so poorly understood that it's more the realm of philosophy than science.

In particular, we all know that we're conscious, but can't really explain what that means.