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Re:Why I Left Oracle – A Confession by toyg on Saturday March 05, 2016 @06:34PM (#11231639)
Look at what Oracle is doing to Google for the sin of refusing the JCP process. Do you think they wouldn't do the same against any Java fork with a realistic chance of supplanting their implementation? The details are not important, they'll throw the book at you and find something that sticks.

The current situation (OpenJDK open but not a realistic choice in most production deployments; Oracle JDK/JRE remaining as de-facto gold standard; a process that forces strict compatibility tests on any competitor) can be fine from a certain point of view, but in practice it means that Java is not a traditional community-led OSS program. Rather, it's a program where the OSS community helps a company improve their software. RedHat is not the only Linux build with significant marketshare, and I won't get sued if I write a different POSIX system.

> at this point there's not enough motivation to do it.

No there isn't, that's what Rhaman is saying. But what he's also implying is that the direction of travel has changed inside Oracle, and people outside do not seem to realize it. IMHO it's fairly obvious where things are going (you'll stop "installing Java", and only develop and deploy in the Oracle cloud or similar Oracle-sanctioned environments).

Re:Why I Left Oracle – A Confession by pron on Sunday March 06, 2016 @01:49AM (#11232767)
> for the sin of refusing the JCP process

That is one interpretation; I can think of others.

> Do you think they wouldn't do the same against any Java fork with a realistic chance of supplanting their implementation?

I think they wouldn't sue anyone complying with their very clear, very standard OpenJDK license. Google, apparently, thinks the same, and has now decided to comply with the OpenJDK license, too.

> OpenJDK open but not a realistic choice in most production deployments

What? AFAIK, Google, Twitter and plenty other companies run their servers on OpenJDK. It is absolutely realistic for most production environments. In fact, Oracle's JDK differs from OpenJDK only in a few monitoring features.

> Oracle JDK/JRE remaining as de-facto gold standard; a process that forces strict compatibility tests on any competitor

That's just not true. The Java standard is the standard, OpenJDK is the reference implementation and one of the most widely deployed implementations.

> RedHat is not the only Linux build with significant marketshare,

Neither is Oracle's JDK. OpenJDK, IBM's JDK and Azul's Zulu all have good market shares.

> and I won't get sued if I write a different POSIX system.

Probably not, but you wouldn't get sued (or, at least no one ever has been sued) if you comply with OpenJDK's open source license. You may well get sued if you don't comply with Linux's open source license, too (which happens to be the same as OpenJDK's).

> and people outside do not seem to realize it

Perhaps, but what's the difference? If they start doing a bad job with Java (so far they seem to be doing fine work), the community will fork OpenJDK.

Re:Why I Left Oracle – A Confession by the_af on Saturday March 05, 2016 @07:29PM (#11231845)
> OpenJDK open but not a realistic choice in most production deployments

This is news to me. I'm aware there are differences, but "not a realistic choice"? Can you elaborate?

Re:Why I Left Oracle – A Confession by NotSammyHagar on Saturday March 05, 2016 @10:04PM (#11232286)
I think openjdk is used in production. It's even going to be used in android in the future. You are incorrect that openjdk is not production ready today.
Re:Why I Left Oracle – A Confession by toyg on Saturday March 05, 2016 @11:13PM (#11232449)
> It's even going to be used in android in the future.

Lol, like that was a choice Google made freely, rather than something they were forced to do.

OpenJDK might be OK in many circumstances (as I said, requirements vary) but you might want to avoid that particular case study.

Re:Why I Left Oracle – A Confession by the_af on Saturday March 05, 2016 @11:31PM (#11232487)
I'm going to be blunt: you claimed "OpenJDK [is] not a realistic choice in MOST production environments" (emphasis mine).

I asked for evidence for this bold claim, since many production environments I know are using OpenJDK successfully, under heavy loads and without crashing. So... evidence of your claim?

Re:Why I Left Oracle – A Confession by the_af on Saturday March 05, 2016 @10:23PM (#11232327)
I didn't claim it wasn't production ready, the parent post did.
Re:Why I Left Oracle – A Confession by lovelearning on Saturday March 05, 2016 @07:38PM (#11231876)
Can you elaborate on why OpenJDK is not suitable for production deployments? I thought Oracle's JDK/JRE were based on OpenJDK's, with only minor changes.
Re:Why I Left Oracle – A Confession by toyg on Saturday March 05, 2016 @07:46PM (#11231894)
Obviously it varies depending on requirements, but my experience is that openjdk tends to be a crashfest and/or end up being incompatible with a lot of stuff out there. The Oracle JDK/JRE invariably Just Works. It might be all a cargo-cult phenomenon (i.e. devs still testing only with Oracle builds out of tradition etc etc), it might be that Oracle have fabulous build tools not seen elsewhere, I honestly don't know; this is just what I see.
Re:Why I Left Oracle – A Confession by manyxcxi on Sunday March 06, 2016 @01:45AM (#11232760)
It's likely and believable that the different flavors seem to run at different speeds with different architectures. I also wouldn't be surprised to find the Oracle implementation to always be faster. I have a real hard time believing that OpenJDK has some huge flaws that prevent its production use as a blanket statement.

Hell, way back in the early 00s I remember having to use the JRocket JDK instead of the Sun one due to some weird corner case- so I am fully aware there are cases you can run in to that would necessitate one implementation over another. But calling OpenJDK unfit for production at this point in it's life is either FUD or straight lack of knowledge.

What are you running that OpenJDK seems to be so incompatible with? I've literally never had an issue with OpenJDK 7 or 8 and I've deployed applications that serve millions of requests per day in many flavors of OS.

Re:Why I Left Oracle – A Confession by benjaminjackman on Saturday March 05, 2016 @09:20PM (#11232180)
I used to experience random crashes with the OpenJDK several years ago, but haven't noticed that recently. Are you still seeing those issues or did you give up some time ago based on the aforementioned crashfest and haven't tried it in the last couple years?
Re:Why I Left Oracle – A Confession by LaSombra on Sunday March 06, 2016 @05:59AM (#11233271)
One thing about OpenJDK is that the debug symbols are freely available so you can try and create a core dump and analyse why the JVM crashed. You can't do that with Oracle's or IBM's JDK AFAIK.
Re:Why I Left Oracle – A Confession by rogerbinns on Saturday March 05, 2016 @10:54PM (#11232404)
On ARM the Oracle version is considerably faster than OpenJDK.