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Re:Why Tech Degrees Are Not Putting More Blacks and Hispanic... by YeGoblynQueenne on Friday February 26, 2016 @06:32PM (#11185103)
>> So only physical characteristics are heritable?

See my point above - physical characteristics are directly observable, and therefore, measurable. Mental, emotional etc psychological characteristics are not directly observable, so are only measurable through a proxy.

In the case of intelligence, the proxy is an IQ test and we don't even have a good definition of what it is we're proxying, so it might not even be a single characteristic, but rather the combination of many traits.

So yeah, we can say very safely that you can get your eyes or your height from your parents, but not so about your IQ.

Corollary, maybe you can inherit your _intelligence_ but since we don't have a good definition of that and no way to measure it directly, there's no solid ground to stand on arguing that this or that "race" has more or less of it. And the same goes for any other group, really.

Full disclosure: I'm interested in this discussion too, mostly because I believe the whole idea of IQ measurements is bogus to begin with.

Re:Why Tech Degrees Are Not Putting More Blacks and Hispanic... by whitegrape on Friday February 26, 2016 @07:46PM (#11185461)
The study of IQ (and the underlying g) is one of two or three (definitely less than 6) crown jewels of psychology. You should probably read the actual science, "we" know quite a bit about intelligence. (I can help get you started if you're really interested, but I suspect you aren't.)
Re:Why Tech Degrees Are Not Putting More Blacks and Hispanic... by YeGoblynQueenne on Saturday February 27, 2016 @05:41AM (#11186738)
Thank you, I am indeed interested and I do read the actual science as you suggest. I study artificial intelligence so I'm in a position to know that there is no universally accepted definition of intelligence, certainly not a formal one that would allow us to encode it in a program and so reproduce intelligence in a machine.

There is very little disagreement on that in the field of AI. In fact, there is so much agreement that we have no idea what intelligence is, that we've totally given up on trying to understand it and instead switched to hoping that intelligence will naturally arise if we create complex enough systems (complex enough that we also don't understand them very well).

All that said, you're welcome to point me to the studies that are relevant to your field and I will gladly go through them, although I can't guarantee that I have the time to do so on time to continue this debate in this thread.

Re:Why Tech Degrees Are Not Putting More Blacks and Hispanic... by whitegrape on Monday February 29, 2016 @01:05PM (#11196975)
Well, if you're looking for understanding that's good enough we can program it, then yeah, we don't understand it. Also I think there was a misunderstanding on my part, in that we know quite a bit about human intelligence (that is, g), but not so much about intelligence-in-general. I'd rather clear up any miscommunication before throwing citations at you -- is your disagreement that g is not a well-established thing which maps very well to any tests of general intelligence you can conceive, or that g is a useless predictor, or that intelligence as measured by g is non-hereditary, or that g isn't useful because it's not a specific module of the brain we can simulate in code or hot-swap with that part of a donor's brain?

People may still quibble, but I was under the impression the standard acceptable definition for intelligence (at least among AI folks) is Legg and Hutter's informal "the ability to efficiently achieve goals in a wide range of domains". (Which has been formalized with AIXI.) I'm also aware of several groups in the AI field who believe they can actually construct a mind, in fact that this is the safest way forward, and that hoping it just "emerges" is folly as old as the first neural net proponents...