With worldwide sales approaching the US sales of the Jeep Liberty.

You're going to compare it to Jeep Liberty sales volume when its consuming the entire top end of the luxury market?

http://cleantechnica.com/2016/01/15/1-large-luxury-car-in-us...

"As we all know, Tesla doesn’t report sales/deliveries by country. However, various outlets estimate Tesla sales using a variety of methods. EV Obsession estimated 26,566 Tesla Model S sales in the US in 2015. Rob notes that the lowest estimate was 24,200. In either case, the Model S outsold the Mercedes S-Class, the BMW 7-Series, the BMW 6-Series, the Audi A7, the Audi A8, the Porsche Panamera, and every other car in this class."

The point is that Tesla doesn't move anywhere near enough volume or generate anywhere near enough sales to justify its market cap. Its previous valuation was almost entirely a prediction of future revenues rather than a reflection of current ones.

And it's hard to say what class the Model S fits in. I don't think 7 or S is right, despite the price point. Those are both full-size luxury sedans, and while the Model S may be a full-size sedan, it's hardly luxury. Its interior is closer to a 3-series or E-class than the top-of-the range luxobarges. That's not a knock on build quality, just the reality of battery power currently being much more expensive than ICE. You've got to shave cost somewhere, and Tesla shaved it off luxury.

>The point is that Tesla doesn't move anywhere near enough volume or generate anywhere near enough sales to justify its market cap.

Buying TSLA right now is making a big bet on the Model 3. If Tesla comes out with a popular car (likely) and can make enough of them to turn a profit (little more skeptical on that one), it may end up justifying valuations. I wouldn't put my money on it, but I'm not surprised other people do.

I think that's a fair point. I suspect Tesla will end up being very much like Amazon: a company that ships physical goods but acts like a tech company. That is, they'll operate on razor-thin margins and dump every penny of profit into R&D in perpetuity. That will probably give them a leg up on companies that pay dividends, at least in the short-medium term. Ultimately, though, they run the "risk" of being Apple: a company that has to spend inordinate sums on R&D in order to gain a 1- or 2-year window of exclusivity before the competition commoditizes their product.

Right... you keep telling yourself that.

http://www.consumerreports.org/cars/tesla-reliability-doesnt...

"Despite the problems, our data show that Tesla owner satisfaction is still very high: Ninety-seven percent of owners said they would definitely buy their car again. It appears that Tesla has been responsive to replacing faulty motors, differentials, brakes, and infotainment systems, all with a minimum of fuss to owners."

That doesn't scale. Tesla doesn't have dealerships across the country to deal with these problems.

TSLA has a reliability issue, and they need to get it fixed before they can deploy the Model 3 at scale.

You keep making excuses while Tesla is executing, delays or no delays. Do you not see the problem with complaining about a company that's actually succeeding step by step?

Tesla hasn't made a profit yet.

So no. They aren't executing. They're a 13-year old company with negative profits across their entire life, and the hopes and dreams of a Gigafactory.

$230 Million lost last quarter. When will TSLA stop burning cash? It has NEVER, in its entire history, made a single profit. This is a 13-year old company, I expect better profits by now.

Instead, TSLA pivots into a space it wasn't designed for, to hope to increase demand to make its gigafactory investment worthwhile. Well, lets see. Lets see if enough people buy powerwalls and Model 3 cars to make it work.

But at a price of "Worth more than FCAU", the stock is horribly overpriced. I expect $20 billion companies to... make a profit. Just saying.

> Tesla hasn't made a profit yet.

> But at a price of "Worth more than FCAU", the stock is horribly overpriced. I expect $20 billion companies to... make a profit. Just saying.

I don't. I expect them to deliver electrified mobility, which they're doing. Why would they turn a profit in a capital intensive industry so soon? I would expect them to burn cash for at least 10-20 years before they're profitable, when you're spending billions of dollars to tool up.

They don't even need to profit! They just need to break even (just like Amazon plows all of its cash into growth).

And I must ask: Why do you care if you don't own Tesla stock? As someone who holds tens of thousands of shares of Tesla stock, I'm willing to give them decades to be profitable. I don't even care if they're ever profitable! As long as they replaces as many internal combustion vehicles as possible.

Mostly because I don't have as much money as you, and thus have to be more selective in my stock purchases.

I congratulate you on your success, but I'm very far away from "investing for shits and giggles". Not everyone has millions of dollars they can give to a company just because they are morally aligned to them. If a company stock isn't going to be a good place for me to store money for the next 5 to 10 years, then I cannot purchase it.

I simply don't live in that kind of world financially.

Two things:

1) I invested when it was $17/share when they went IPO. It was a gamble, but a gamble I was willing to make.

2) You don't have to live in that world financially. Just understand that everyone is attempting to push in the right direction, as Tesla is doing.

I'm not a Tesla fanboy by any means. I'm a "please for the love of god fix the energy sector before we all die" fanboy.

I am very many years (if at all in my lifetime) before I can afford to take a $100,000 gamble.

Again, I congratulate you on your success, but you and I live in very different worlds.

It is a big deal if I can scrape together $5000 once or twice a year for a stock purchase.