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Re:Born Poor? Santa Fe economist Samuel Bowles says you bet... by gjm11 on Thursday February 04, 2010 @05:21PM (#1101807)
I think your comment on the $250k proposal is wrong.

The US has a population of, let's say, 300M. In any year, let's say 1/60 of that many -- 5M -- are just turning 18, which is when Bowles proposes handing out the money. (He's not proposing to give that much to everyone all at once.) So the annual cost is $250k times 5M, or about $1T. There's no $56T up-front cost.

Now, $1T/year is an awful lot: it's about 1/4 of what the US government currently spends in a typical year. It's about what the US government currently spends on "defense". It's hard to see where the money could come from. On the other hand, it would completely obliterate poverty in the US. On the other other hand, it's very convenient for a lot of people that there is poverty in the US; without poverty, no one would work for very low salaries, which means a lot of things that are currently cheap would become more expensive. (You can generally recognize countries with less income inequality because low-end goods and services cost more.) On the other other other hand, it does seem like it would make entrepreneurship much more widely accessible.

Bowles is a very smart guy. The idea may be crazy, but it's unlikely to be stupid.

Re:Born Poor? Santa Fe economist Samuel Bowles says you bet... by isleyaardvark on Thursday February 04, 2010 @10:51PM (#1102646)
Fair enough, I assumed that initially everyone over 18 would get $250k. Now you could say that's an unrealistic assumption, but... so is the program. 19 year-olds can vote, how enthusiastic would they be for a program where they get the shaft? And the under-18s can't vote. People will expect to get something. (Consider Social Security, when that started people received benefits before they had paid a dime into the system.) Costs would inevitably balloon out of control. And that's not even considering other practical concerns. What about fraud? What about both legal and illegal immigration?
Re:Born Poor? Santa Fe economist Samuel Bowles says you bet... by timwiseman on Thursday February 04, 2010 @05:53PM (#1101899)
No, the idea is not stupid, but I think you are making some unfounded assumptions.

it would completely obliterate poverty in the US.

Not really, it would do little to help people in poverty already past 18 (unless they had children who were both just about to turn 18 and those children were generous...). Even for those that benefitted from this, to assume they would not go back to poverty you have to assume they will use it wisely (and possibly have some luck too.) If they go to college or start a business with that money, then they probably will move up and sustain themselves at least in the middle class. Probably. On the other hand, I bet a large percentage would spend it quickly and have relatively little to show for it at the end.

Even those who start a business/go to college are not gaurunteed to stay in the middle class, they just have a good shot. Many businesses fail, and then those founders would be left with little but that experience. Many people with degrees are unemployed right now.

I am not saying it is a bad idea necessarily, and I am certainly not about to dismiss it as stupid, but I do not think it will come close to wiping out poverty.

Re:Born Poor? Santa Fe economist Samuel Bowles says you bet... by isleyaardvark on Thursday February 04, 2010 @10:57PM (#1102666)
On the other hand, I bet a large percentage would spend it quickly and have relatively little to show for it at the end.

Professional football players make a ton of money, and guess how many end up filing for bankruptcy within 2 years of retirement: 78%.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1...

Re:Born Poor? Santa Fe economist Samuel Bowles says you bet... by huherto on Friday February 05, 2010 @12:40PM (#1104158)
Just to entertain the idea. Let's say that if you want to go to college you get the money at 18. If you want to buy a house you get the money at 20. If you want to start a business; you get 100k at 22, and 150k at 26. To ensure that you are mature enough, and have a chance to fail(and learn) once.

I know that adding rules makes things more complicated and can have unintended consequences.

Re:Born Poor? Santa Fe economist Samuel Bowles says you bet... by anamax on Thursday February 04, 2010 @11:23PM (#1102707)
> On the other hand, it would completely obliterate poverty in the US.

No, it wouldn't.

Most lottery winners end up bankrupt.