News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Io Programming Language (new website design) by smt88 on Friday November 20, 2015 @11:48PM (#10605679)
Edit: Rust's website has an open-source license[3]. You can copy the code and use it directly! That's great news because they host it on S3 with Jekyll, which is ridiculously inexpensive.

I'm not an expert or a designer. Your users will show you how to improve the design because you'll see evidence of where they're getting tripped up. For example, if a certain page is the last one most people see before leaving the site (other than front page), then you can tell that page A) solves a problem, or B) causes people to lose interest.

A good starting point is to look at other language sites and decide which ones seem friendliest and least friction-y. How easy it is to get started?

As examples, I really like Rust's website[1], and Elm[2] is pretty good, too. Rust's site is great because it's readable, all the important stuff is above the fold, and it has big action buttons. They also give a fairly long example of syntax, which is important.

I've even seen some languages that will show a snippet of code in an existing, comparable language, along with that same snippet translated into the new language. That's a great way to make your language accessible.

1. https://www.rust-lang.org

2. http://elm-lang.org

3. https://github.com/rust-lang/rust-www

Re:Io Programming Language (new website design) by throwaway1 on Saturday November 21, 2015 @12:57AM (#10605846)
No no no ... don't lift another project's website directly, it's tacky and will make your project look second-rate.

Why do you insist on dominating the thread like this anyway? For my money, "reply to every replier" users are in a dead heat with "horse sense theory" users (like the one at the top of the HIV thread earlier, always followed w/ reams of "aw shucks, thanks!" replies) as the top nuisance on HN.

Re:Io Programming Language (new website design) by smt88 on Saturday November 21, 2015 @01:13AM (#10605882)
> No no no ... don't lift another project's website directly, it's tacky and will make your project look second-rate.

It's easy to change the look and feel drastically with CSS, while keeping the file structure and HTML layout. It's not any different than downloading or using a website template, which is itself not much different from using a library in any programming language. Standing on the shoulders of giants is a core value of software.

> Why do you insist on dominating the thread like this anyway?

I only mostly replied to people who were in my own comment thread. That's called a conversation.

If I've inserted myself into anything unnecessarily, it's because usability and accessibility are really important to me. I want languages like this to succeed on their merits, rather than suffering due to unfriendly design. Plus I have friends and relatives with visual impairments.

Re:Io Programming Language (new website design) by throwaway1 on Saturday November 21, 2015 @01:35AM (#10605930)
But that's the thing! Caring about usability isn't enough. Are you a domain expert? Have you read your Jakob Nielsen and such?

Because Nielsen, for instance, probably wouldn't slam this design as hard as you have: For a work in progress, it's pretty danged good. The homepage is obvious, it presents the most important things in a way that nobody could miss. I'll grant that the "binaries" link is a bit obscure, but that's copy. There's some wasted space on the homepage but that's not a huge deal because the website's simplicity puts most things only a click or two away. The "packages" page is great! The tutorial could use a monospace font, but otherwise is great too.

I really hope that your advice doesn't result in iolanguage.org becoming a clone of Rust's website or otherwise an impersonator. The authors here are trying something new and unique and what they've pulled off is already looking sharp and easy-to-use.

So yea, I think you're just trying to sound like an expert. Trust me, you're not the only person here who knows about usability (if you do, that is -- you come off as more of a frontend developer than a real UX person, because your suggestions are lacking in depth and experience, and the HTML/CSS bit in your reply makes you sound especially green).

Re:Io Programming Language (new website design) by smt88 on Saturday November 21, 2015 @01:47AM (#10605953)
I told OP that I'm not an expert or designer and that the best advice comes from observing users.
Re:Io Programming Language (new website design) by fractallyte on Saturday November 21, 2015 @03:02AM (#10606128)
Rust's website is the opposite of this: BUSY!

Just look at that landing page: logo, menu, intro, download buttons, code example (and editor), features - all 'above the fold' (on my screen).

Sure, everything's there, but from a design perspective, there's no real focus on any one component. Sometimes that focus is actually the design intention. In that sense, the Io website hits it perfectly.

Re:Io Programming Language (new website design) by kibwen on Saturday November 21, 2015 @04:14PM (#10608054)
The Rust website absolutely has a focus: the single-sentence description in an enormous font, directly adjacent to the enormous and obvious "Install" action button.

Other than that, the page contains nothing other than the code example (a 100% must for any language homepage), the documentation links (a 150,000% must for any language homepage), and the short feature summary that supports the focus sentence.