> I'm not sure the licensing response would work in the case of the code developed over the course of a startup weekend event.

You can always license any code you wrote.

> How do teams address the issue of IP/ownership? As with any startup, the team decides.

That's not how copyright law works.

> You can always license any code you wrote.

No you can't ...not if someone else has a claim on the work you do. I can't put "copyright <my name>" on the code I write at work ... its "copyright <my company>"

EDIT: re license vs copyright : I also can't just unilaterally decide what license I use for code I write at my company. I think its reasonable to think the same would hold true given that FAQ item.

> That's not how copyright law works.

That was from the SW weekend FAQ. But I think that FAQ holds weight -- just like my statement above. If the rules for the weekend are the "team decides" you can't just go claiming ownership of stuff you did for the team.

You seem to have a deep misunderstanding of copyright law. Just because you created work as part of a group does not mean you have surrendered your copyright unless you have signed a contract to the contrary.

Without surrendering copyright, you absolutely do have the right to unilaterally license your code in whatever way you want. The entire reason that companies require you to sign IP agreements before starting work is to ensure that you don't run off with the code.

The developers wrote the code and never signed a license to Billy's company. They own it. End of story.

my misunderstanding of copyright law is indeed deep ..and I keep digging myself deeper into this argument hole :)

thanks for the clarifications.

That's because you signed a contract surrendering your IP to your company. If no contract is signed, then ownership of IP you create defaults to you, as it should.

If he is an employee acting within the scope of his employment when he writes the code, the copyright belongs to the employer because it is a "work for hire". There is no need for a contract that states the employee surrenders his rights to the company because the employee doesn't have any rights to surrender--the employer is legally the author and it is in the employer that the initial copyright vests.

exactly -- and arguably some weekend hackathon or similar event where you arguably surrender your IP to the group.

so the "you can always license any code you wrote" isn't always at all

EDIT:

so, my "exactly" above is a wrong. I see your point about signing a contract vs not. got it. I'm sticking with my arguments about "always" ..its all I have left :)

Yeah, to be clear, I'm in favor of surrendering IP to the group for an event like this, because if you split everything up at the end it'll be worthless.

BUT! Terms like this need (both legally and ethically) to be explicit, and should have provisions for both "person X stays on-board" and "person X leaves after the weekend."

Does "work for hire" extend to verbal contracts?

No. See http://www.copyright.gov/circs/circ09.pdf . "A work created by an independent contractor can be a work made for hire only if (a) .. and (b) there is a written agreement between parties specifying that the work is a work made for hire." (Emphasis mine.)

> If the rules for the weekend are the "team decides" you can't just go claiming ownership of stuff you did for the team.

That's a nice opinion. But as you say, it's a "rule". It's not the law.

And the law disagrees with you. If 5 people write code with no legal framework in place (such as a written contract), they each own their individual contributions.

got it re the legal framework.

it would interesting to see something like this tested in court.

Do you know what qualifies as a legal framework when entering a weekend hackathon? Is there a different bar for something like this vs a standard employment situation?