Hacking Team, Computer Vulnerabilities, and the NSA

Re:Hacking Team, Computer Vulnerabilities, and the NSA by harry8 on Tuesday September 15, 2015 @11:48PM (#10224563)

I'm pretty sure you're completely missing the point. Any time somebody suggests something is "against the law" in a discussion about the NSA practises we need to remind ourselves that they really don't care whether they break the law. They do it nakedly, in public, with live television coverage and there are no consequences.

The NSA is a criminal organisation. I don't say everything they do is crime or that is there sole raison d'etre just that they don't care about the rule of law. The law is something that they don't need to worry about at all.

Does anyone really dispute that? "I gave the least untruthful answer I could..." Lying under oath. No consequences for that crime or any other.

No respect for the rule of law.

Please don't miss that point, the rule of law is the point, it is a necessary condition for a civilized society and MOST ESPECIALLY the government needs to be bound by it.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Hacking Team, Computer Vulnerabilities, and the NSA by HiYaBarbie on Wednesday September 16, 2015 @12:43AM (#10224732)

You're right to point out that the NSA doesn't give a fuck about the law, but..

> the rule of law is the point, it is a necessary condition for a civilized society and MOST ESPECIALLY the government needs to be bound by it

You seem to be overlooking the fact that the organization that makes the laws is, by definition, above them. The government is not bound by its own laws any more than a King or Emperor by his, back in the day.

The reason why you see crimes go unpunished is that people with political power and/or connections are effectively above the law.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Hacking Team, Computer Vulnerabilities, and the NSA by harry8 on Wednesday September 16, 2015 @01:45AM (#10224885)

One thousand times NO. The rule of law applies to all equally. This the ideal insofar as it is agreed that our current implementation does not achieve that it is an agreed deficiency. The president murders their spouse, expect them to be charged. By definition the rule of law applies to all. The End. Period. The price of freedom is eternal... etc.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Hacking Team, Computer Vulnerabilities, and the NSA by HiYaBarbie on Wednesday September 16, 2015 @07:50AM (#10225905)

> One thousand times NO. The rule of law applies to all equally.

This is just your cognitive dissonance talking.

You can say "NO" a million times, but Bradley Manning was just imprisoned without trial (and tortured for months.. years?), even though Habeas Corpus was supposed to apply.

> The president murders their spouse, expect them to be charged.

Why would you expect that? If the president murders his spouse, he's probably reasonably sure he'll get away with it. Otherwise he probably wouldn't.

> By definition the rule of law applies to all.

That's what we're trained to believe.. so many TV shows and movies show police officers risking their lives in fighting crime and courts being fair and just and all, but have you ever dealt with the court system? Did you get justice?

You've probably heard of "plea-bargaining", right? http://www.truth-out.org/news/item/12556-overwhelming-use-of...

People are blackmailed into accepting a punishment for something they haven't done, to avoid the potential life-ruining punishment for whatever outrageous bullshit they're charged with (that they haven't done either).

And you insist that everything is fine?

Maybe this will clarify things: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BNIgztvyU2U

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Hacking Team, Computer Vulnerabilities, and the NSA by SEJeff on Monday September 21, 2015 @11:13AM (#10252831)

No not really. As a US Soldier, you sign away 100% of your constitutional rights when you voluntarily sign the contract.

So many civilians get this wrong it isn't funny, but the only code that applies to US military members is the UCMJ (uniformed code of military justice), of which Bradley (now Chelsea) Manning was a member of.

Source: I'm a US Army veteran and learned all about this.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Hacking Team, Computer Vulnerabilities, and the NSA by harry8 on Wednesday September 16, 2015 @02:45PM (#10228824)

You have to accept the rule of law is a worthy ideal to find any real or imagined example of its infringement a problem. To give up on it, to give up on the ideal, to stop raging against the violation of that ideal is to give up on Freedom.

I won't.

[ Parent | on HN ]